2004 - WEEK 47 46008 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 07:00:45 -0000 From: "Cosmic Girl" womanofoz8@... Subject: Re: OT ETs and other quotes Hi Sterling, You write: "Do the various population centers of the various E.T races have isolated heavens where the departed spirits between lifetimes reside, or is there commerce between them? Do they have border crossing conditions from one heaven to the other? What about the "hellish" post mortality experience that some who have lived horrible lives experience? Is there commerce (interaction) between the hells of the various population centers of the galaxy?" I was thinking about the experience of death this week and what happens when one passes over into the astral realm, and I wondered where exactly this astral realm was in the Universe. So far, I have come to this conclusion, and I would like to hear other views on this, if they wish to share their thoughts. Our chakras obviously reside in our true body or etheric body and the solar plexus is the astral/emotional body chakra, therefore when a person dies, do they then return to the chakra relating to the astral emotional body? Do they enter this chakra at death which is connected to the Etheric Body? If someone is a Disciple and dies, does this person then enter the chakra for the head centre and reside there whilst the body(matter) crumbles and returns to the earth? If we cannot as yet see our true etheric body, then when we leave the physical body at death, are we really only returning to the astral level/chakra of our true etheric body, until we come back into another physical body. If one has a hellish life in the physical body, then it makes sense that this would transfer over into the chakra system of the etheric body. I also read that when someone dies in a car accident etc, they pass over into the etheric body which is not really good for the etheric body and places stress(?) on that body. If so, then the various ET races would probably have their own etheric bodies with connecting chakra systems to pass over into at death and have their own oversoul of the planet that they reside on. Even the Earth must have its own chakra centres and then the other planets also, and the seven rays work through the seven major chakras within the bodies. Hi JohnC, I like reading your quotes taken from the Bible, however, I have no idea what these quotes mean when they are written in the old language, as I have never studied Bible interpretations of the words, and do not have enough time to study all of these words and their interpretations, as yet. I wondered whether, if you had time, that when you quote from the Bible, you could add your interpretation on the quote and what it means underneath. Some of us here have never studied this area of the Biblical terms or have been to Church etc etc. Therefore when I read something like these quotes, they go right over my head because of the terms they use to describe events and because of the symbolism used. I found the Gospel of the Nazarenes easy to read, but other than that book, I usually have no idea what the Disciples are really trying to say in their words, unless I have read JJs interpretation. Thankyou. Cosmic Girl 46009 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 07:30:56 -0000 Fro: "Cosmic Girl" womanofoz8@yahoo.com Subject: Re: OT Bible Quotes Just as an example: "17:1 And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will show unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:" Me: I understand about the Seven Angels/Seven Rays/(all of the One God), however, what are the seven vials and who is the great whore, and why are they calling it a whore? Why be derogatory about the female aspect, by using the term whore? Why should this aspect be called a whore by those men or even God, when God made woman and man in His image? (I am trying to understand this use of the term Whore, from a female point of view, and yes, I know its only a word, but why use that word then, especially since down the ages, men have used it against women in a negative way). Not unless they mean Lucifer(Whore), and as Lucifer was an Angel, then perhaps this entity is related to the female aspect rather than male. "19:7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready." Me: Who is the Lamb marrying? Or is this about Spirit and Matter joining as one, or higher soul and lower soul joining in marriage as One soul? Why didnt they just say that, instead of Lamb and Wife? Me: So who is the Lamb, Jesus or the Christ? And why use the term Lamb in the first place? "21:9 And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will show thee the bride, the Lamb's wife." Me: Why are they holding seven vials full of the seven last plagues? Are these plagues what they sent out into the Earth to kill people? Why are they still holding the vials then? Who is the Lamb's wife? 21:15 And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof. [Interesting, that the task of this angel was to measure the heavenly Jerusalem, but John's future mission was (in Rev. 11:2-5) to measure the earthly temple and those who worship therein.] Me: Is this temple a symbolic term for or of humanity's consciousness? 22:9 Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy felowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God. Me: So the book had already been written and planned out and then left for humanity to make the right choices about what happens in between the lines of this book. I guess there is a book on every planet in the billions of Universes outlining their future and past history as well. Cosmic Girl 46010 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 09:00:53 -0000 From: "Rick Audette" rick1@... Subject: OT answers to some PXL/floating city stuff I copied these questions last time, to prepare answers off-line. Here they are. Anyone can write me a private e-mail, if they'd like to continue off list. Rick Susan: Patent pending is thought to give more protection without disclosing all your information as a full patent would. There are other avenues such as "trade secrets" etc to use also. Then there is the open sourcing idea: spreading the word and letting the world have it. There are arguments for doing it either way. Rick: "Patent Pending" is the status of a patent, between the time the application is received by the Patent Office and it's granting the patent. It allows the inventer to safely disclose all to prospective investors and manufacturers while waiting for the full patent (about one year). "Open Sourcing" or public disclosure would prevent anyone from getting a patent on the idea, including me. This is fine with me, because, although I loose exclusivity, I can go get the invention made and begin selling it, without having to worry that someone else will try to patent it and stop me from making and selling them. Pneumatic Crystal Lattice is such a basic idea, found throughout nature ( in the mineral, plant and animal kingdoms), trying to protect the idea would likely involve endless litigations, throughout the life of the patent. If you can't patent something as simple as the wheel or fire, the biggest profits will be made by those that get a quality product out fastest and cheapest (that was how Edison worked it). My fantasy solution is that a "New Age" company be formed, to be the first to manufacture and sell the invention, regardless of which type of protection they choose, public or private, with myself as a permanent designer/promoter/shareholder. Being the first company in the market and having the original designer on board is no guarantee of being #1, but it does have the advantage of a head-start over the competition. Susan: On the business side, to interest an investor they either want a patent or a strong trade secret position preferring the patent. An investor would want to make money so will be more likely to insure it gets "out there." Too often the inventor does not make the money he thinks he is going to and the investor patents around the inventor or through some loophole cuts him out. I think with proper mental techniques of attracting the right investor this doesn't have to happen. Rick: Well, I covered the patent question, so what about "trade secrets"? Unfortunately, the idea is so simple, even a child could deduce it's "secrets" at a glance. Everything you need to know, to build the perfect PXL, I could draw on the back of a napkin in less than 60 seconds (although I have a 30 year head start on how this product could be used). Owning and running a business would be a disaster to my creativity, because my creativity depends on me staying on the fringe, not the center. Synthesis is a keynote of the New Age and I would gladly enter into it to help usher it in . Susan: In either case, people want to see a prototype. I know that I have seen the one unit you built, but it would be more convincing of its uses to have a mini-city built with it or like a fort for kids or something that would be easy to transport, but show the principles. Then you can take it to investors to try and stir up interest (like rich builders in Houston or Dallas etc). Sometimes turning it over to some one else to market for you may be helpful (as inventors can be their own worst enemies in negotiation...They can't have all the talent....) Rick: The prototype you saw was from the second generation series of models used to demonstrate the principle. I have since designed an easier model to manufacture and even built a tool to stamp out prototypes, instead of gluing parts together. Still, my tool cannot produce PXL's as good and fast as equipment already in use by inflatables manufacturers. If I went to these manufacturers to have prototypes made, the "secret" would be out. One way around this is to draw illustrations of PXL assemblies. The problem, until this week, with drawing assemblies, in 3D, was there are an unlimited number of structures that can be built and manipulating parts in "virtual reality" took as long or longer than just assembling them physically. A few days ago, I came up with a way to draw assemblies of hundreds of PXL's with a single click, on the computer. Using that technique, I was able to draw an assembly, this morning, containing over 1500 PXL's, in less than an hour. Still, seeing PXL's, even for me, is not the same as touching them. I drew many pictures, before building the first prototypes. I had a pretty good idea of what they could do, but when I actually held an assembly in my hands it was mind blowing, because they worked even better than I had imagined. I've already explained why making any more physical prototypes would be risky, until the "protection" issues are resolved, but, from my experience, I know that, with the models I do have, plus assembly drawings, I have enough to convince would-be visionaries to invest in the idea. Susan: I personally think the business route is more viable to getting the technology out in the world. Open sourcing is more for hobbyists. Since the aquarian age is supposed to more be about right relations even in business, I think if you try to pisces "sacrifice" your technology you would be out of sync with the energies trying to come in to the aquarian age. Why shouldn't you benefit financially? Perhaps you as a strong financed person will then have the means to build a city of light? Rick: Sacrifice will not go away in the New Age, as it is a key ingredient to every degree of initiation/evolution. Prometheus (which lit. means Forethought) stole fire from the gods for the benefit of mankind. His reward was Zeus chained him to a rock, where a vulture pecked out his liver, which grows back each night. That story never made much sense, until I found myself in his shoes. It is a very tricky question, but finding the right answer is key to bringing in the New Age and becoming a white magician. I don't want to be a "strong financed" individual. I would rather be a member of a strong GROUP Susan: Good luck with it Rick. I have always had the best of hope for you in this regard as I think it is a fantastic idea. So I would suggest make a really good prototype, get patent pending and go find an investor or two. Rick: I can begin talks now, if interested parties first sign a non-disclosure agreement. Dan: How much dinero are you thinking it will take to get a patent? Rick: A patent costs about $7,000. If I retained a patent agent, for $2,000 to start the process, the application would be filed within about a month. Once filed, it is then "patent pending", allowing investing, manufacturing and sales to begin, so the cost of the patent could be paid for by the invention itself, instead of out of pocket. Dan: Will the manufacturing process involve special equipment and/or training? Rick: Not at all. It requires machines already used in the making of mylar ballons and inflatable beach toys. Operating this machinery is no harder than a silkscreen press. Given that I was able to produce working models at home, I think these could be manufactured even with primitive technology, in a mud hut in a third world country, if need be. Dan: How soon could you be in production? Rick: There is a manufacturer only a few miles from my house. If the idea was protected and I had the cash, I could go there tomorrow and place an order for the first batch :) Dan: So far you have said the units could be used as floating buildings (water, air, space) are there any more "down to earth" :-) consumer applications? Rick: The PXL units are building blocks from which ANY ultra-light rigid structures can be made. With an unheard of strength to weight ratio (on water, 1 pound of material will float 1,000 pounds of payload), they are very practical for building in areas where conventional materials would be hard to deliver. A building as big as a house could fit in the trunk of your car. An airplane could carry it's own hangar, in the cargo bay. World turmoil creates millions of homeless refugees. With PXL's, whole cities could be built in only a few days. Building on a parking lot or open field, you could create a large convention center in a matter of hours. Deflated PXL's are flat and can come in many colors, so you could use them for very large scale graphics. Imagine a billboard as big as a mountain (don't fault me for thinking of it. You know somebody will try it). Large scale sculptures, like a statue of liberty, exhibit towers, pyramids, etc.can easily be moved from one show to the next. Given that these PXL's are kind of like giant leggo blocks, even a child could engineer impressive and useful structures. I'm sure you can think of more uses. Dan: Do you anticipate the unit cost to be within the economical reach of the average consumer? Rick: PXL's can be made any size and strength, depending on what they will be used for. They are shaped like equalateral triangles, so the following dimensions refer to one side of a triangle. The first PXL's on the market would probably be 18" mylar "toys", each less than the cost of a beachball. 36" PXL's, made of vinyl or rubberized cloth, make larger, more durable structures and would cost in the same range as a floating air mattress. Large PXL's, made from materials like life-rafts which are used for "white water" rafting are made of, would be 6-12 ft. on a side. These bigger, tougher PXL's are what you would need to build larger buildings and floating cities. I don't know what the price range would be for the big ones, yet. Dan: Who do you envision to be your major market? Rick: I see it starting out as a "toy", of interest to all ages. After a relatively short amount of "hands-on" experience with what can be done with them, the need for larger, stronger units will come fast. Dan: Have you looked in to what kind of startup costs are going to be involved in manufacturing the product? Rick: You need an RF sealing machine. If you already have one, you just need a new die for it (probably under $2000). You also need rolls of mylar or vinyl. Then you can start stamping them out. Estimating what it would cost me to make them hasn't been given much energy, because I always figured that, like most inflatable "toys", I could not produce them as inexpensive as ones I could have made in China. Dan: On what scale must the "units" be manufactured at what end-user cost to be feasible? Rick: That is beyond my skills to calculate, but I can predict that the scale would go up and cost come down, compared to products now being made on the same equipment. Why? Because, when a consumer goes to the store to buy a beachball, he probably only wants to buy one. If he goes to the store to buy PXL's, he's going to want them by the dozens or hundreds and will be back for a few more boxes, in a week or two, when the misses tells him to add on a room for mother-in-law, LOL. Dan: A "normal" venture capitalist is probably going to frown a bit on the "freely sharing it" idea however :-) Rick: That's O.K. I don't hang out with many "normal" people anyway ;) 46011 Date: Sun, 21 Nov 2004 23:31:53 -0600 From: Gail Raby graby@... Subject: Re: (OT) Need ET Theology: Exotheology Sterling Wrote: Let's say in my next life I yearn for a particular experience that will not be able to be fulfilled for eons on this planet, so I wish to go to another galaxy where a planet is at a certain stage and configuration so I can have a particular experience. Is there a group evolution that keeps me "stuck" with this planet or galaxy, like a child is generally stuck with its family while growing up? Gail: I believe it was Cayce who said that often between earth incarnations we can sojurn on various other planets for a time -- the reason for going to a given planet would have to do with certains types of experience to be had there. The types of experiences could fall in line with the astrological/spiritual meanings assigned to those planets. Have you ever felt a specil affinity with any of the planets -- if so, maybe its because you were there. PS -- I joined your group. G 46012 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 09:12:21 -0000 From: "Rick Audette" rick1@... Subject: Re: O.T. Who is Hilarion? I have read, in several sources, that Paul, in a later incarnation, was Hilarion. I never paid much attention to anything attributed to Hilarion, most likely because Paul is my least favorite author in the NT. My favorite is John. If I learn they are close buds, I guess I'll have to take another look at Shorty :) Rick 46013 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 04:52:16 -0500 From: "Keith Harris" theslothis@... Subject: RE: Re: O.T. Who is Hilarion? John C. wrote, "...I think DK is saying that Hilarion dictated the Book of Revelations to John,..." John, I think you have some strong circumstantial evidence - very convincing. Rapter Keith 46014 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 05:11:54 -0500 From: "Keith Harris" theslothis@... Subject: RE: Re: (OT) Need ET Theology: Exotheology There are some obscure references in D.K. regarding the deva kingdom and differing related colors being associated with certain classes of deva's. I think that some of these so called E.T.'s might be related to the deva kingdom. Rapter Keith (Just a thought) 46015 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 04:16:20 -0700 From: J J Dewey jjd@... Subject: ETs Part 1 Sterling asks about ET's and how they fit in the scheme of things. I have written a few things about them in the past, but have not put a lot of attention on them. The main reason for not putting a lot of attention on them is that we humans here on the earth are responsible for our progression and the direction we take as a people and planet. ET's in space ships have no immediate mission to help us along or interfere with our destiny. That said I will give you a few of my beliefs about ET's. They may or may not be true. (1) Physical self conscious life dwelling on the surface of a planet with technology more advanced than ours is rare in the universe. The only ones capable of interstellar flight are members of the Brotherhood who have transcended physical reality and are capable of taking physical matter to the higher ethers where the speed of light can be transcended. When they reach their destination they can recreate themselves on the physical plane and have interplay. The Brotherhood only travel in spaceships when they have cargo that needs to be transported. Such cargo are various types of seeds and vegetation animals and other types of life for which to seed certain planets. When taking a cargo is not necessary then an advanced member of the brotherhood can merely travel in his spiritual body and be born amongst us. Then there are other times he may share a body with a willing disciple, using his eyes and ears as a way to explore our world. Nature made the stars so far apart to prevent the interference of one system with another until they developed the spiritual technology to transcend space. When this technology is developed then the beings are responsible enough to not unduly interfere with other planetary lives. The Dark Brotherhood on other planets can, through meditation, create etheric vehicles that are capable of reaching earth, but they are unable to descend to the physical once they get here. They are able to commune with their disciples on the earth who have a sympathetic vibration. Even though advanced physical life is rare, elementary physical life is much more common. There are many more planets that have fairly simple human life than have advanced life. We are ahead of many sister planets because we have had more stimulation from advanced lives. Every planet with a molten center has life either on its surface or its interior. The gas giants like Jupiter and Saturn have lives that are gaseous and unlike anything science has imagined. Even though the earth is the only planet with physical life on its surface, it is not the only one with intelligent life. On each planet there are other spheres made of the higher ethers and there intelligent life exists. There are many more self conscious beings on the higher ethers than there are on the dense physical. The conditions for life on the physical plane are very demanding whereas on the higher planes the right conditions are more plentiful. There is always rejoicing in a solar system when the conditions are met for self conscious physical life because there are opportunities for growth here that are not available elsewhere. You'll note that in many sightings of UFO's the person will state that the ships made maneuvers that seemed impossible in physical reality. Some report a ship moving at incredible speed and then coming instantly to a full stop or a sharp turn that defies the laws of physics. The reason for this is the ships were not physical, but made of etheric matter and the chances are they came from this solar system rather than outside of it. There is a lot of misinformation about ET's and UFOs. About 99% of what we hear reported on them is either not accurate or just not true. There are three main reasons for this: (1) The orthodox reasons given by the government - mainly people making mistakes in observations. (2) People tend to manifest that which they believe. Before 1947 no one was reporting being visited by aliens, but after a few sightings were reported, and many started believing in ET's then the power of this belief manifested much illusion around the subject. The power of belief mixed with desire causes many to see visions of ET's which they mistake for reality. (3) People mistake etheric vehicles for physical. You'll note that in most stories of visitation they are awakened from sleep. In many cases they are still asleep but are having an experience in a quasi dream state. Sometimes it is real contact with etheric beings and other times it is their imagination playing tricks on them. To be continued. Human Beings are just good enough to make democracy possible...just bad enough to make it neccessary. Reinhold Niebuhr (1892 - 1971) Copyright 2004 by J J Dewey 46016 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 11:30:53 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: O.T. Who is Hilarion?/CG/Keith/Rick To Keith: Well, I haven't proved that it was Hilarion, but there was SOMEBODY telling John what to write and what not to write. To Rick: I agree. John is my favorite, and "shorty" is my least favorite. For those who don't know Paul or Saul means "short". I forgot about Hilarian being Paul. I knew I heard of him before. I don't those two would get along together very well, but you never know. To CG: When I read your first post about interpreting the Bible, I thought, OK I'll fill in a little more background. In the second post, when you explained what your questions were, I'm now thinking that to understand all of my explanation, you'd almost have to understand all of the Book of Revelations. But, as I said, I have read it hundreds of times. The book is very symbolic and contains multiple levels of interpretations. It would not be enough just to present the book in modern language. JJ has commented a lot about this book. You could take all his commentary and it would fill a book in and of itself. Then, he could write enough additional commentary to fill several more books. In short, there is no easy way to approach this book, so all you can do it take it one bite at a time. Let's keep it as simple as possible by leaving out unnecessary details. This is a very ROUGH presentation, as opposed to JJ's polished presentations. I am trying to cover a lot of ground, so I'll skip around. I hope this helps. An angel is a messenger. He or she could be a flesh and blood person, or somebody appearing in a vision. I believe JJ has gone into this in detail somewhere in the archives, particularly with regard to the angels in the Book of Revelations. Revelations is supposed to be a book of prophecy of the future. John constantly refers to books in the Book of Revelations. He is not referring to the Bible because the Bible was not yet compiled. In most cases, he is referring to the Book of Revelations itself. Other times he is referring to the Book of Life, which you might consider to be the Akashic Record, or to the little book which he eats, which symbolizes a future mission he has to perform. The only reason I brought up the angels and the vials is to show that the messenger that John wanted to worship (twice) could be the same person both times. Each time that the messenger tells John about the "Bride of Christ" (Christ being the bridegroom), John wants to fall down and worship the messenger. When we were talking about Zion on the Keys a couple of months ago, I mentioned that the Bible always speaks of Zion as a female. This is the bride of Christ. When Christ resppears, he will come to a world at peace and will seek out a people who are prepared for him. He will link up with his people. This relationship is compared to a marriage with Christ being the bridegroom, and his people as the bride. Each time the messenger talks about the Bride of Christ, John wants to worship the messenger, but the messenger tells him not to do it because he is his fellow-servant. In short, the messanger did not want John to consider him as an unearned authority. What I did not go into detail in my post was that throughout the Book of Revelations, John is being guided through the experience by an angel. There could be several different angels, or they could all be the same angel, but the point is, John had a guide who was directing his attention and telling him what to write and what not to write. You could consider this "dictation". Hope this helps. John Keith wrote: John C. wrote, "...I think DK is saying that Hilarion dictated the Book of Revelations to John,..." John, I think you have some strong circumstantial evidence - very convincing. 46017 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 11:47:52 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: ETs Part 1 JJ wrote: To be continued. This subject of ET's comes up about once a year, and you have written several posts on the subject. I haven't really thought or worried much about ET's, but what you say on the subject makes a lot of sense to me. This topic of ET's and UFO's needs a sane and balanced approach, which is what I find in your writings on this topic. There is something there; it's just not what we think. I think Sterling could believe this and still be true to his traditional theology, if that's what he wants. Perhaps some enterprising person who also had a real interest in this topic could gather all these posts together and compile them into another "book". Then we could put a link to it up on Larry's site. I am NOT volunteering myself, because I have little interest in the subject; my focus is elsewhere, but others might have a real interest in this. John 46018 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 08:12:47 -0700 From: "Susan Carter" susan@... Subject: Re: OT answers to some PXL/floating city stuff How many models do you all ready have? While you are quite visionary and can mentally see things clearly, often those with money are more left brained and need it in front of them, plain like. What are the models of? Are any of the models hooked together at all? Another question, how do you hook them together? Seperate substance like glue or ?? To make something like a floating city, I would want to know how strong it is from having holes poked into it. Anything you know better than rubber raft material to make it from? I agree this would make an ideal product for a group to do something like a molecular business with. Figuring out costs will be pretty straightforward and then figuring price to see if it is all doable. If any questions need a non-disclosure email me yours or I will give you my standard one and we can finish the conversation privately. Susan Rick Audette wrote: Rick: The prototype you saw was from the second generation series of models used to demonstrate the principle. I have since designed an easier model to manufacture and even built a tool to stamp out prototypes, instead of gluing parts together. (snipped for brevity) but when I actually held an assembly in my hands it was mind blowing, because they worked even better than I had imagined. I've already explained why making any more physical prototypes would be risky, until the "protection" issues are resolved, but, from my experience, I know that, with the models I do have, plus assembly drawings, I have enough to convince would-be visionaries to invest in the idea. Dan: On what scale must the "units" be manufactured at what end-user cost to be feasible? Rick: That is beyond my skills to calculate, but I can predict that the scale would go up and cost come down, compared to products now being made on the same equipment. Why? Because, when a consumer goes to the store to buy a beachball, he probably only wants to buy one. If he goes to the store to buy PXL's, he's going to want them by the dozens or hundreds and will be back for a few more boxes, in a week or two, when the misses tells him to add on a room for mother-in-law, LOL. 46019 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 17:24:16 -0000 From: "Robert" maxlight33@... Subject: Re: OT answers to some PXL/floating city stuff Hey Rick, this could be the opportunity to get backing and money to start a business. I do understand about the creativity thing, but you don't need to be in charge if you don't want to, this would be good anyway because you should have someone who knows and has run a business. As you have started this list, you can put together a team to start the business. You know how to put together a team, just do it again and keep yourself in the creative mode. Oh by the way, there is creativity in business. If you get a chance, I would read the december issue of "Fast Company" magazine because it is their creativity issue and they even talk about the most creative company and It is not Apple or Microsoft, it is Gore-Tex. Their whole business model is based upon teams, where your only boss is the team. Read the article in the December issue of "Fast Company" magazine" I believe that magazine is better them "Entrepreneur Magazine" but anyway, hope this idea will spark some more ideas. Robert Rick wrote: Rick: I see it starting out as a "toy", of interest to all ages. After a relatively short amount of "hands-on" experience with what can be done with them, the need for larger, stronger units will come fast. Dan: Have you looked in to what kind of startup costs are going to be involved in manufacturing the product? Rick: You need an RF sealing machine. If you already have one, you just need a new die for it (probably under $2000). You also need rolls of mylar or vinyl. Then you can start stamping them out. Estimating what it would cost me to make them hasn't been given much energy, because I always figured that, like most inflatable "toys", I could not produce them as inexpensive as ones I could have made in China. 46020 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 18:30:14 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: OT answers to some PXL/floating city stuff Robert wrote: If you get a chance, I would read the december issue of "Fast Company" magazine because it is their creativity issue and they even talk about the most creative company and It is not Apple or Microsoft, it is Gore-Tex. Their whole business model is based upon teams, where your only boss is the team. Hi Robert, Thom and I were just discusssing this subject yesterday. As you may or may not know, I used to work for Microsoft. At one time they were much more creative than they are now, and they used to be made up of small, atonomous teams, each focused on a single project. If somebody had an idea for a new product and could sell the idea to management, they were given funding to start a product unit. Unfortunately, this is not so much the case anymore. I understand that many managers at Microsoft saw the Internet coming and begged Bill Gates to start embracing it, but he refused to take any interest in it until Netscape came on the scene and became so popular around 1995. I read an article today that said IE is now losing market share to FireFox and some of the other newer browsers because of security concerns and a lack of simple features like tabbed panes and pop-up blockers. This surprises me, because I could write a pop-up blocker in less than a week. And a guy I know at work wrote his own tabbed browser, all on his own. I don't know why it took MS so long to do it, given their vast resources. I better stop before I get all wound up. I still have a lot of respect for MS, having worked there. The people and atmosphere were great, but apparently not as great as they used to be. The company still values Initiative, but no longer encourages it or rewards it. If Rick can start a company based on the molecular business model, it would be a great place to work, I am sure. Oh, one thing you also pointed out, Robert. Innovators and inventors don't always make the best CEO's. But the question is how to retain financial and creative control over the company while still doing what you love and what you do best, and leave the nuts and bolts to somebody who does that best and who loves doing that. John 46021 Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 12:30:07 -0800 (PST) From: "bryan a. smith" smithgiant@... Subject: JJ's Quote For The Day "Knowledge, by itself, even when confirmed through soul contact, has no stability without the other two legs of the triangle which are Wisdom and Understanding." -- JJ Dewey The above quotation was taken from: http://thenewagesite.com/jjdewey/archives/article.php?num=1106 46022 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 01:03:00 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: OT - Researching Master K.H I thought I'd do a little research on Koot Hoomi, or Master K.H., since JJ mentioned that he would eventually take over the role of World Teacher when Christ moves on to other things in 1000 years. The first thing I want to present is a statement which was supposedly channeled through a lady named Ruth A. Craig. You can judge for yourself. I like it very much myself. In fact, the more I read this, the better I like it. We can speed up the process of transformation and we have Master K.H. offering to help us. Keep in find that the teacher will not appear until the student is realy. From here on, my comments will be in [brackets]. Everything else is a direct quote. Kuthumi works today to facilitate those that are interested in transforming their own energies. Kuthumi states "If enough individuals do this, increasing the vibratory rate of the whole, a transformation of the human race is possible. While no work is greater than another, spiritual work of this kind is very efficient. It is possible to speed up the process of transformation." "None of us can clear and move away totally from that which we are a part of because we are all connected. So, I make myself available for individuals to clear, to become conscious about their experience, to become more aware of what they want and what they are trying to accomplish in their evolutionary process." --Master Kuthumi Then a few quotes from JJ: http://www.thenewagesite.com/jjdewey/archives/article.php?num=969 [This is Alice A. Bailey speaking here.] I found that this visitor was the Master K. H., the Master Koot Hoomi, a Master Who is very close to the Christ, Who is on the teaching line and Who is an outstanding exponent of the love-wisdom of which the Christ is the full expression. http://www.thenewagesite.com/jjdewey/archives/article.php?num=714 [JJ is writing about three masters who are thought to have been the three wise men. Catholic legend tells us that there were exactly three wise men, since there were exactly three gifts given to the Christ Child, and even gives them names. I don't happen to agree with this, but one opinion is as good as another when it comes to facts like this. To me, the important thing to know about them is that they work closely with the Christ, and that they are "the most important from our point of view".] Those who accept his [DK's] writings usually refer to him merely as the "Tibetan". This Master works in close connection with Koot Hoomi as well as Master Morya and all three of them are in close association with the Christ. They are all "resurrected beings", using Christian terminology. In esoteric language they are referred to merely as "the Masters" or the "Masters of Wisdom". The Christ once hinted at these associates in a revelation given to Joseph Smith: "Wherefore, I will that all men shall repent, for all are under sin, except those which I have reserved unto myself, HOLY MEN THAT YE KNOW NOT OF." D&C 49:8 These holy men that the world and even many prophets knew not of were the Masters. There are many Masters, but the three mentioned above are of the most important from our point of view. Koot Hoomi is next in line to take over the position of The Christ in about a thousand years from now when the present Christ will move on to other work. http://www.crystalinks.com/kuthumi.html [Here is a link which describes many of the masters. They quote a lot from Alice A. Bailey, so most is this is probably not too far afield what what JJ and DK teach. I enjoyed reading about what is thought to be K.H.'s past incarnations. Several authors have attempted to trace out past lives of masters and initiates. It is always interesting to me where the lines intertwine, and there they contradict one another. In this line, it is stated that Master K.H was once Aristotle. George Hunt Williamson in his book "Secret Places of the Lion" states that one of the incarnations of John the Beloved was Aristotle. If this is true, then that would make Master K.H. and John the Beloved the same person. It would be interesting to hear JJ's thoughts on this. But, my first quote sounds very much like something JJ or John would say. Also, note the reference to Shah Jahan, the emperor of India who build the Jah Mahal as a memorial to his wife, whom he deeply loved. Haven't we read about another "Jahan" in Book III? A joke: If Shah Jahan built the Taj Mahal, then I expect some modern- day guy named "John" to build the "Taj Mall". Just kidding. On a serious note, going back to the quote from Master K.H. at the top of this post, where he says he is willing to work with those who are prepared for him to assist them, and taking another revelation to Joseph Smith which says that the mission of John the Beloved was to tarry on the earth and assist those who will be heirs of salvation. Another interesting parallel to think about.] The Temple of Love, Wisdom and Understanding Kuthumi comes to those who seek world knowledge in this time of change - and to use that accumulated knowledge for the good of all and to overcome the tendency towards intellectual arrogance. He was allegedly born in the early nineteenth century, Mahatma Kuthumi was a Punjabi whose family had settled in Kashmir. He led an secluded life. He attended Oxford University in 1850 and is believed to have contributed "The Dream of Ravan" to The Dublin University Magazine around 1854, prior to returning to his homeland. The Kashmiri Brahman spent considerable time in Dresden, Wurzberg, Nurnberg, and at the university in Leipzig, where in 1875 he visited with Dr. Gustav Theodor Fechner, the founder of modern psychology. His remaining years were spent at his lamasery in Shigatse, Tibet, where his contact with the outside world included didactic writings sent by mail to some of his devoted students. Those letters are now on file with the British Museum. Past Lives Thutmose III Pharaoh, prophet, and high priest in the period of the New Kingdom c. 1460 B.C., who expanded the Egyptian kingdom to include most of the Middle East. His most decisive victory was on a battlefield near Mt. Carmel where he led the entire army single file through narrow Megiddo Pass to surprise and defeat an alliance of 330 rebellious Asian princes--a daring maneuver protested by the pharaoh's terrified officers. Thutmose alone was assured of his plan and rode ahead holding aloft the image of AmenRa, the Sun God who had promised him the victory. Pythagoras Greek philosopher of the sixth century B.C., the "fair-haired Samian" who was regarded as the son of Apollo. As a youth, Pythagoras conferred freely with priests and scholars, eagerly seeking scientific proof of the inner law revealed to him in meditation upon Demeter, the Mother of the Earth. His quest for the great synthesis of truth led him to Palestine, Arabia, India, and finally to the temples of Egypt where he won the confidence of the priests of Memphis and was gradually accepted into the mysteries of Isis at Thebes. When Asian conqueror Cambyses launched a savage invasion of Egypt c. 529 B.C., Pythagoras was exiled to Babylon where the prophet Daniel still served as king's minister. Here rabbis revealed to him the inner teachings of the I AM THAT I AM given to Moses, and here Zoroastrian magi tutored him in music, astronomy, and the sacred science of invocation. After twelve years, Pythagoras left Babylon and founded a brotherhood of initiates at Crotona, a busy Dorian seaport in southern Italy. His "city of the elect" was a mystery school of the Great White Brotherhood where carefully selected men and women pursued a philosophy based upon the mathematical expression of universal law, illustrated in music and in the rhythm and harmony of a highly disciplined way of life. After a five-year probation of strict silence, Pythagorean "mathematicians" progressed through a series of initiations, developing the intuitive faculties of the heart whereby the son or daughter of God may become, as Pythagoras' Golden Verses state, "a deathless God divine, mortal no more." At Crotona, Pythagoras delivered his lectures from behind a screen in a veiled language which could be fully comprehended only by the most advanced initiates. The most significant phase of his instruction concerned the fundamental concept that number is both the form and the essence of creation. He formulated the essential parts of Euclid's geometry and advanced astronomical ideas which led to Copernicus' hypotheses. It is recorded that two thousand citizens of Crotona gave up their customary lifestyle and assembled together in the Pythagorean community under the wise administration of the Council of Three Hundred; a governmental, scientific, and religious order who later exercised great political influence throughout Magna Grecia. Pythagoras, the "indefatigable adept," was ninety when Cylon, a rejected candidate of the mystery school, incited a violent persecution. Standing in the courtyard of Crotona, he read aloud from a secret book of Pythagoras, Hieros Logos (Holy Word), distorting and ridiculing the teaching. When Pythagoras and forty of the leading members of the Order were assembled, Cylon set fire to the building and all but two of the council members were killed. As a result, the community was destroyed and much of the original teaching was lost. Nevertheless, "The Master" has influenced many great philosophers, including Plato, Aristotle, Augustine, Thomas Aquinas, and Francis Bacon. Balthazar One of the three Magi (astronomer/adepts) who followed the star (the I AM Presence) of the Manchild born to the Virgin Mary. Believed to have been the King of Ethiopia, Balthazar brought the treasure of his realm, the gift of frankincense to Christ. the eternal High Priest. Saint Francis of Assisi The divine poverello, who renounced family and wealth and embraced "Lady Poverty," living among the poor and the lepers, finding unspeakable joy in imitating the compassion of Christ. While kneeling at Mass on the feast of Se. Matthias in 1209, he heard the gospel of Jesus read by the priest and the Lord's command to his apostles, "Go, preach." Francis left the little church and immediately began evangelizing, preaching the doctrine of reincarnation as Jesus had taught and converting many disciples, including the noble Lady Clare who later left her home dressed as the bride of Christ and presented herself to Francis for admittance to the mendicant order. One of the many legends surrounding the lives of Francis and Clare describes their meal at Santa Maria degli Angeli where Francis spoke so lovingly of God that all were enraptured in Him. Suddenly the people of the village saw the convent and the woods ablaze and running hastily to quench the flames, they beheld the little company enfolded in brilliant light with arms uplifted to heaven. God revealed to St. Francis the divine presence in "brother sun" and "sister moon" and rewarded his devotion with the stigmata of Christ crucified. The prayer of St. Francis is yet spoken by people of all faiths throughout the world: "Lord, make me an instrument of thy peace!..." Shah Jahan Mogul emperor of India in the sixteenth century who overthrew the corrupt government of his father Jahangir and restored, in part, the noble ethics of his grandfather Akbar the Great. During his enlightened reign, the splendor of the Mogul court reached its zenith and India entered her golden age of art and architecture. Shah Jahan lavished the imperial treasury not only on music and paintings, but especially on the construction of awesome monuments, mosques, temples, and thrones throughout India, some of which may still be seen today. The famous Taj Mahal, "the miracle of miracles, the final wonder of the world," was built as a tomb for his beloved wife, Mumtaz Mahal, who died in 1631 giving birth to their fourteenth child. Shah Jahan spared no effort in making the temple "as beautiful as she was beautiful.' It is the symbol of the Mother principle and the shrine of his eternal love for his twin flame. Ascended Master Kuthumi Formerly Chohan of the Second Ray of Divine Illumination, now serves with Jesus as World Teacher. He is the hierarch of the Cathedral of Nature, in Kashmir, India, and head of the Brothers of the Golden Robe. Kuthumi also maintains a focus at Shigatse, Tibet, where he plays sacred classical music of East and West and compositions of the heavenly hosts as well as of earth's early root races on an organ keyed to the music of the spheres, drawing souls by the sacred sound that is God out of the astral plane into the etheric retreats of the Brotherhood. Hope you found this interesting, John 46023 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 05:55:00 -0000 From: "Cosmic Girl" womanofoz_8@... Subject: Re: ETs JJ wrote: "We are ahead of many sister planets because we have had more stimulation from advanced lives." I wondered why out of all the planets in the Universe/s that the higher entities wanted to *stimulate* the beings on Earth? Was it because the *Gods* impregnated the Earth with their own divinity by mistake, or for a definate reason, and that made them chose Earth over other planets? Or was it because Earth is the sister soul planet of Venus, and the Morning stars from Venus came here, and One Lucifer wanted to dominate the whole of Earth and the other higher beings, and in implanting that presence upon the Earth, the Earth then had the attention and stimulation from the higher realms and beings, so that they could *save* that planted seed which had sprouted. Cosmic Girl 46024 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 06:23:00 -0000 From: "Cosmic Girl" womanofoz_8@... Subject: Re: OT Master KH Ascended Master Kuthumi Formerly Chohan of the Second Ray of Divine Illumination, now serves with Jesus as World Teacher. He is the hierarch of the Cathedral of Nature, in Kashmir, India, and head of the Brothers of the Golden Robe. Kuthumi also maintains a focus at Shigatse, Tibet, where he plays sacred classical music of East and West and compositions of the heavenly hosts as well as of earth's early root races on an organ keyed to the music of the spheres, drawing souls by the sacred sound that is God out of the astral plane into the etheric retreats of the Brotherhood. Hope you found this interesting, John Hi John, I found this particular sentence very interesting: ".....drawing souls by the sacred sound that is *God* out of the ASTRAL plane into the ETHERIC retreats of the Brotherhood." Is this pointing out that the souls are *trapped* within the Astral realms, and therefore, by playing the sacred sound that is God, those souls that are mildly still conscious of God are drawn out of the astral realms via that music and are then drawn into the etheric retreats of the Brotherhood for preparation and further advancement in consciousness into another incarnation? I have just started reading The Division of Consciousness by Peter Novak, and he describes the Soul as Unconscious(Soul) and Conscious (Spirit), and that is why at death the two split apart and one incarnates again, the unconscious part of Soul, that is why we have no conscious memories of what happened before or who we were, and he also writes that this is what all religions are basically referring to and why the West is split from the East, as in Reincarnation vs Heaven and Hell. Another interesting point he made in the beginning of this book is how "science has long known of curious exceptions to this rule - single-celled creatures which, instead of dying in our fashion, just divide and multiply. Their example, although modest, is precious beyond estimation, for it shows that nature already contains instances in which death takes the form of division." Cosmic Girl "For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart." -Hebrews 4:12 46025 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 04:22:08 -0700 From: J J Dewey jjd@... Subject: ETs Part II First let memake a correction to yesterday's post. (Hopefully Larry will catch it.) I said: "Even though the earth is the only planet with physical life on its surface, it is not the only one with intelligent life." This should have read: "Even though the earth is the only planet in the solar system with physical life on its surface, it is not the only one with intelligent life." That said, let us go to some of Sterling's questions: "My awareness of the ET issue has grown from a passing interest into a conviction, and with that conviction comes a hole in my theology -- a void because it is not addressed in the theology with which I was raised, and even the newer theology that I am considering as I comb the world and its varied richness of theological teachings that are generally absent in the religion in which I was raised, though not necessarily incompatible with it." JJ Actually, I'm sure you are aware that life on other planets is taught in the LDS scriptures so the fact that there are ETs out there should already be incorporated to a degree. Here are several scriptures pointing this out: "And he beheld many lands; and each land was called earth, and there were inhabitants on the face thereof." MOSES 1:29 "But only an account of this earth, and the inhabitants thereof, give I unto you. For behold, there are many worlds that have passed away by the word of my power. And there are many that now stand, and innumerable are they unto man; but all things are numbered unto me, for they are mine and I know them." MOSES 1:35 What is not taught in the LDS scriptures is anything about UFOs, but even if they do exist it doesn't change much. Any ETs would be much like us traveling through a series of lifetimes until liberation is achieved. Sterling How do ETs fit into the plan of progression, ours, theirs, and the idea of a hierarchy of benevolent beings ("God") who actively superintend events on the planet in the form of the Holy Ghost and guardian angels, in opposition to demonic impressions and guidance from the dark brotherhood, as you call them? JJ Each planet with life has a Hierarchy within a greater Hierarchy of a solar system. The God who is the head of this earth is the Ancient of Days and is a disciple of the Solar Logos who dwells in the Sun in refined matter in a state of livingness incomprehensible to humans. Our star system is one of seven systems composing a greater Hierarchy. The head of this greater system is so advanced he is merely called "The One About Whom Naught Can Be Said." The reason he is called this is that his consciousness is beyond the reach of even the Masters. All they can do is register his influence and know of his existence. Contrary to popular belief the Spiritual Hierarchies in the universe are created from the bottom up rather than the top down. In other words, once you go so far up you will discover new Hierarchies in the process of creation. How far above The One About Whom Naught Can Be Said does the reach of Hierarchy extend? This is not given. Hierarchies which exist on a fairly equal basis cooperate with each other. For instance the Logos of Venus and Earth are closely related for our Logos came from Venus. Significant sharing goes on between the various planetary hierarchies. The Hierarchies of our solar system have a close connection with the system of Sirius. The planets around Sirius do not have advanced humans in the dense physical, but have a very advanced brotherhood in the higher ethers. This Sirius Brotherhood of Light is in a system of a sun many times as brilliant as our sun and shares its light and intelligence with our hierarchies. All this has nothing to do with ETs as the world sees them, but they are extraterrestrial nonetheless. Any ETs who have advanced technology would be under the hierarchy of their native planet and would be subject to working out their liberation just as we are. Sterling: Theologically, who are the E.T.'s and what role do they play? Are we their inferiors spiritually? I would imagine there is quite a wide gamut there, from highly evolved technologically, but not spiritually, to highly evolved spiritually but not so affixed technologically; from highly benevolent, to highly malevolent. There seems to indeed be a galactic, if not intergalactic "war" between the forces of good and evil analogous to the struggle here on this planet. From what I understand, our planet is not a sitting member of our galactic federation because we are not advanced enough to have representation, so we have a sort of "little child that needs to be watched over" status. JJ I Answered part of this in my last post, but will add this. Most of what you hear about galactic war and federations is from unreliable channeled material who got their inspiration from Star Trek. There is no such thing as an intergalactic war. There are 200 billion star systems in this galaxy alone and not with advanced enough humans who are close enough together to even war among themselves on the physical plane. The current universe is young yet and when we explore other solar systems we will find that most of them have been untouched by any federation and are waiting our assistance in their development. The inhabitants of this planet are one of the seeds of the galaxy which will sprout and grow to other systems. The only real federations in the galaxy are the two brotherhoods who are not connected in the dense physical. Sterling: What role do E.T.'s play in the formulation of earthly theology? What role do E.T.'s play in actual epiphany/manifestation kinds of phenomenon? JJ The ET in a spaceship has little or nothing to do with earthly theology. Theology and doctrine has been developed through earthly lives who have contacted their souls or higher lives connected with this earth. Sterling: Do their angels visit and appear and influence here? Do ours go there to their various civilization centers? JJ No and no with this caveat. There are representatives higher than the angel kingdom who visit various hierarchies and offer help. Sterling Do the various population centers of the various E.T races have isolated heavens where the departed spirits between lifetimes reside, or is there commerce between them? JJ Normally between lifetimes entities will dwell in the astral and mental spheres of their own planet. Each person has a ring-pass-not that they cannot pass because of the limitations of his consciousness. Those with higher consciousness may visit other planets within our system but rarely outside of our system. Sterling Do they have border crossing conditions from one heaven to the other? JJ As I said it can happen. Sterling What about the "hellish" post mortality experience that some who have lived horrible lives experience? Is there commerce (interaction) between the hells of the various population centers of the galaxy? JJ Not for the normal hell where the person is condemning himself and punishing himself with guilt. However, both the light and dark brotherhoods have overcome the problem of guilt, but by using two different methods. The Dark Brothers have seared the conscience with a "hot iron," as the scriptures say, and the Brotherhood of Light have transcended guilt through understanding the Love of God, or the Atonement as taught in the scriptures. Thus do the advanced Dark Brothers have their own brand of liberation (which is temporary) which allows them some interplanetary contact in the lower ethers. They do not see themselves as being in hell because they are not suffering with guilt. Even so, they dwell in a kingdom of shadows with no glory from the light of god. Sterling Let's say in my next life I yearn for a particular experience that will not be able to be fulfilled for eons on this planet, so I wish to go to another galaxy where a planet is at a certain stage and configuration so I can have a particular experience. Is there a group evolution that keeps me "stuck" with this planet or galaxy, like a child is generally stuck with its family while growing up? JJ Something like that, but it has more to do with your ring-pass-not which keeps you in a system until you learn the lessons of that system. Sterling When we think of life after life (mortality followed by mortality, with a "spirit world" breather in-between where choices are made about what the next mortality will entail), and we consider our brother-sister beings of other civilizations in the galaxy, and we consider that some of them are "adopted" into our group evolution, and vice versa, then it is conceivable that advanced beings from ET races occasionally incarnate in our civilization to help us accomplish certain things. JJ Yes, but their number is small. To be continued. It is said that power corrupts, but actually it's more true that power attracts the corruptible. The sane are usually attracted by other things than power. David Brin (1950 - ), Copyright 2004 by J J Dewey 46026 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 13:29:23 -0000 From: "rainbowcal2001" rainbowcal2001@... Subject: Re: OT- Researching Master K.H. Kuthumi works today to facilitate those that are interested in transforming their own energies. Kuthumi states "If enough individuals do this, increasing the vibratory rate of the whole, a transformation of the human race is possible. While no work is greater than another, spiritual work of this kind is very efficient. It is possible to speed up the process of transformation." "None of us can clear and move away totally from that which we are a part of because we are all connected. So, I make myself available for individuals to clear, to become conscious about their experience, to become more aware of what they want and what they are trying to accomplish in their evolutionary process." --Master Kuthumi Arit: Thanks John C. I find this very very interesting and I felt very excited when I read the above quote. 46027 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 11:26:59 -0500 From: "Keith Harris" theslothis@... Subject: RE: ETs Part 1 J.J. wrote the following, "...You'll note that in most stories of visitation they are awakened from sleep. In many cases they are still asleep but are having an experience in a quasi dream state..." Very good point J.J. I like to call this phenomena the false awakening. People can experience this phenomena without realizing they are not actually physically awake. They incorporate the experience as waking reality, because they cannot comprehend full consciousness as anything but being physically awake. Rapter Keith 46028 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 16:53:46 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: ETs Part 1 Keith Harris wrote: J.J. wrote the following, "...You'll note that in most stories of visitation they are awakened from sleep. In many cases they are still asleep but are having an experience in a quasi dream state..." Keith: Very good point J.J. I like to call this phenomena the false awakening. People can experience this phenomena without realizing they are not actually physically awake. They incorporate the experience as waking reality, because they cannot comprehend full consciousness as anything but being physically awake. John: I can vouch for that. One time I was driving on the Interstate in Arizona at night. I stopped the car on the edge of the desert to get some sleep. I had a dream where I was still driving the car. I dreamt that I got sleepy and pulled over the car to get some rest. I was shaken out of the dream because the car was actually moving. I realize what had happened was that in my sleep, I had started the car and was driving in my sleep. So, what was happening in the dream was just the exact opposite of what was happening in real life. Luckily, there were no injuries and no damage. But, from then on, I always hide the keys before I go to sleep in the car. Another point. Raw memory is not necessarily reliable, and it is suggestible. Remember the false cases of alleged child molestation? Some might disagree with me, but under hypnosis, the subject is open to any and all suggestions from the practitioner and could manufacture memories or experiences in order to "please" the practitioner. Therefore, I don't put too much stock in past-life regression under hypnosis. However, with Scientology auditing, there is no sleep or unconsciousness in present time; the auditor, through a series of specially designed processes and commands, gets the person to look, and whatever comes up, comes up. The auditing is not addressed to the person's body, but to the spiritual entity which IS the person. The object is not for amusement for for spiritual betterment. I don't have any evidence to prove whether these memories are true or false. But, whichever, they are, if they are affecting the person in present time, they must be confronted and seen for what they are. When this is done, the person is no longer focused on some past incident, but his attention is in present time. John 46029 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 09:08:01 -0800 (PST) From: "bryan a. smith" smithgiant@... Subject: JJ's Quote For The Day "Look at the current perception, and then encourage that which is positive to magnify and grow." -- JJ Dewey The above quotation is taken from: http://thenewagesite.com/jjdewey/archives/article.php?num=1134 Regards 46030 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 12:10:53 -0500 From: "Keith Harris" theslothis@... Subject: RE: ETs Part 1 J.J. wrote the following, "...Before 1947 no one was reporting being visited by aliens,..." Actually, there are numerous reports of alien contact before 1947. Each culture masks the contact with differing camouflage. This phenomena seems to reflect the cultural expectations of whomever they come in contact with. There is definitely a reality behind the phenomena, but I do not think they are E.T.'s. Rapter Keith (I would speculate that the phenomena is natural to earth, but not yet understood.) 46031 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 20:53:38 -0000 From: "Robert" maxlight33@... Subject: OT tech biz Robert: The ScreenSavers (tech show) and another company had a contest at who could get more people downloading FireFox. One thing I find interesting is at how open source works well with windows. I use an open source product for my office suite "easy office" and will be experimenting with gimp for windows. It's no wonder why linux is becoming Microsofts biggest competitor. Anyway, since you worked for microsoft, I have a question. I was listening to Leo Laporte "the Tech Guy" show on his podcsst feed (http://leoville.tv/airchecks/rss.xml )and he mentioned something to the fact that IE was getting two good (back when it started i guess) because people we're developing web applications, programs that could run over the web instead of installing a regular program on the hard disk. Was IE really that close? One day that I look forward to is having a computer that does everything my laptop does that fits in my pocket. Don't know if the pocket PC's are that good yet, I use an old Palm 7. John: I read an article today that said IE is now losing market share to FireFox and some of the other newer browsers because of security concerns and a lack of simple features like tabbed panes and pop-up blockers. This surprises me, because I could write a pop-up blocker in less than a week. And a guy I know at work wrote his own tabbed browser, all on his own. I don't know why it took MS so long to do it, given their vast resources. I better stop before I get all wound up. I still have a lot of respect for MS, having worked there. The people and atmosphere were great, but apparently not as great as they used to be. The company still values Initiative, but no longer encourages it or rewards it. If Rick can start a company based on the molecular business model, it would be a great place to work, I am sure. Oh, one thing you also pointed out, Robert. Innovators and inventors don't always make the best CEO's. But the question is how to retain financial and creative control over the company while still doing what you love and what you do best, and leave the nuts and bolts to somebody who does that best and who loves doing that. John 46032 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 22:45:13 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: OT tech biz Anyway, since you worked for microsoft, I have a question. I was listening to Leo Laporte "the Tech Guy" show on his podcsst feed (http://leoville.tv/airchecks/rss.xml )and he mentioned something to the fact that IE was getting two good (back when it started i guess) because people we're developing web applications, programs that could run over the web instead of installing a regular program on the hard disk. Was IE really that close? John: I'm not exactly sure about your question, but I think you are asking if it was/is possible to run applications on a server without downloading them down to a PC using IE?? The answer was "yes" back in 1998, and the answer is still yes. They weren't just "close", they were actually doing it. IE has many features which the average person is not aware of, and which programmers seldom use, because they aren't common to all browsers/ Also, most web developers are graphics artists, not programmers. But I have written web apps which look just like desktop apps. The problem they have is they run a lot slower because you are continually uploading and downloading information. (Just compare web- based Email with desktop Email.) But, I don't know why that would be unique to IE that people would stop liking it, except for the fact that in addition to the beneficial ActiveX objects which you download, malicious programmers can lure the unsuspecting user to a website which downloads viruses inside of ActiveX objects. Netscape had Java and plug-ins, but they had built-in features which prevented Java applets from writing to the hard disk. I think Microsoft and a lot of companies are going to a mixed-model, where you download a desktop client, which queries the web for the additional components it needs, and automatically doanloads software updates. I think this is the best of both worlds. Examples I can think of are Quicken and virus checkers. Hope this answered your question. John 46033 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 23:10:47 -0000 From: "T. Rob B. Jr." trobbjr75@... Subject: Re: ETs Part 1 I remember seeing a documentary that talked about ancient artwork (and more recently but before 1947) depicting objects that resemble present-day descriptions of aircraft of unidentifiable origin. This doesn't jibe with your no-ufo-sightings-pre-1947 theory. JJ, you say that people from other planets fold their bodies up into the spiritual in order to transcend the speed of light, but they can only do this with their own bodies. They can't transport other things like seeds and animals for which they would need ships. Well that explains why the Avatar of Synthesis can't manifest physically-- we've been visualizing him with clothes on! lol :) Actually, I have a number of questions: Why can't these higher beings transport cargo but they can transport robes with their bodies? Jesus appeared wearing robes, mana came from "heaven" in the Bible, in the Bible many "angels" appeared wearing robes, and in The Immortal book 4 the characters Joseph and John caused different objects to descend onto the physical. If the Brotherhood can descend objects onto the physical then what's the big whoop about transporting physical objects (which would require an ascension at the point of origin and a descension at the destination)? What makes us so special that, out of all the trillions of planets in the universe, advanced lives would want to pay attention to us for the purpose of stimulating our growth? What'd they do, draw from a lottery and it just so happened to be earth's lucky day? You wrote: "chances are [the ships] came from this solar system rather than outside of it." What would be the purpose of ships traveling within our own solar system? What are these ships doing/transporting? What was so special about the year 1947 that people started reporting seeing UFOs at that time but not previous? Why not 1847? What would be the purpose for etheric beings visiting humans while they're in a quasi-dream state? Do crop circles have anything to do with the UFO phenomenon? If not, what causes them (the unexplained kind, not the man-made kind)? Rob Keith Harris wrote: J.J. wrote the following, "...Before 1947 no one was reporting being visited by aliens,..." Actually, there are numerous reports of alien contact before 1947. Each culture masks the contact with differing camouflage. This phenomena seems to reflect the cultural expectations of whomever they come in contact with. There is definitely a reality behind the phenomena, but I do not think they are E.T.'s. 46034 Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 23:22:13 -0000 From: "T. Rob B. Jr." trobbjr75@... Subject: Re: ETs Part II What is being shared? Can you be more specific than just saying "energy"? Rob JJ wrote: Significant sharing goes on between the various planetary hierarchies. 46035 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 01:21:01 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: ETs Part II DK says that "all is energy". I know that's no help to you, but that might be as specific as JJ can get. I believe, but I could be wrong, but I was reading about SK today, and DK says that only he can fully comprehend contact with other planets in the solar system, and with Sirius. I could be wrong about the other planets, but I am pretty sure about Sirius. T. Rob B. Jr. wrote: What is being shared? Can you be more specific than just saying "energy"? 46036 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 15:37:02 +1300 From: Glenys Lowery jewelinthelotus@... Subject: Sagittarius Full Moon Hi everyone Just to let you know that you can read four Sagittarius full moon commentaries here: www.worldservicegroup.com Their titles are: "Riders on the Storm" Glenys Lowery, NZ "Following the Arrow of Freedom" Trevor Leese, Scotland "Purpose, Direction and the Within-ness of Things" Steve Nation, NZ "Thanksgiving at Aunty Mary's", Malvin Artley, Australia Much Love Glenys 46037 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 15:37:15 +1300 From: Glenys Lowery jewelinthelotus@... Subject: Sagittarius Full Moon Hi everyone Just to let you know that you can read four Sagittarius full moon commentaries here: www.worldservicegroup.com Their titles are: "Riders on the Storm" Glenys Lowery, NZ "Following the Arrow of Freedom" Trevor Leese, Scotland "Purpose, Direction and the Within-ness of Things" Steve Nation, NZ "Thanksgiving at Aunty Mary's", Malvin Artley, Australia Much Love Glenys 46038 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 03:24:54 -0000 From: "Robert" maxlight33@... Subject: Re: OT tech biz John C wrote: I think Microsoft and a lot of companies are going to a mixed- model, where you download a desktop client, which queries the web for the additional components it needs, and automatically doanloads software updates. I think this is the best of both worlds. Examples I can think of are Quicken and virus checkers. Yes John, it does. Thanks. one more if you don't mind, is this how search engines work? Robert 46039 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 03:24:59 -0000 From: "nirvanastarseed" nirvanastarseed@... Subject: Re: ETs Part II JJ seems to be saying that we are the ones ahead here, and that things are so new there is hardly any life out there at all up to our level. I don't see how you could come to the conclusion that this planet is some how more special or ahead than the rest of the universe, I see our development the other way around.If anything we are the ones behind. In all likelihood, there is probally thousands of civilizations out there. Most of them ahead of ours. It makes more sense if you think about it. We are rather primitive. 46040 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 04:12:25 -0000 From: "Robert" maxlight33@... Subject: Re: ETs Part II nirvanastarseed wrote: JJ seems to be saying that we are the ones ahead here, and that things are so new there is hardly any life out there at all up to our level. I don't see how you could come to the conclusion that this planet is some how more special or ahead than the rest of the universe, I see our development the other way around.If anything we are the ones behind. In all likelihood, there is probally thousands of civilizations out there. Most of them ahead of ours. It makes more sense if you think about it. We are rather primitive. Are we premitive though? Haven't we mastered the basic forces of nature? Wind, Fire, Water, Earth, Nuclear. All we need to be working on next would be Gravity. Just in the last 20 years, look what we did compared to what caveman did. We are even at the point at creating life from other means. Even the morality questions we're in the mist of working on. When we are finished with that, well think of what we will accomplish. We are at the point of either losing all or gaining all. It is no wonder why tentions in the world are so great, we are working on many things on many levels. I would say we're advanced. Just my thoughts, Robert Another thought, if we see ourselves (humanity) as one life only to have been reborn as a new civilization from the past, it could be said that we relearned what we knew in the past as a child relearns everything from their past lives to a point of learning more in the adult years. Just another thought. 46041 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 04:42:14 -0000 From: "Cosmic Girl" womanofoz8@... Subject: Re: ETs Part II Im pretty sure that ancient Egypt had a landing pad for spacecraft. I think crop circles are either manifested by the Higher Beings or come from under the Earth, or are just part of the Earth as God sending us some symbols about events etc. The Sumerians were a very advanced race which I think came from another star system and then left, as they knew all about the planets etc. Thoth the Atlantean talks about his ship hidden under the Sphinx. I also think that Atlantis was actually a space craft which could go under the Earth, but was made to look like part of the Earth. As our Earth was inhabited by Higher Beings, then this would seem to make these beings as Gods or ETs not native to our Earth anyway. Perhaps they also *planted* all of our history and memories and made up the story about God and the Angels, because we werent ready to receive the real truth about most things we perceive from our, at first, primitive views thousands of years ago. Didnt a huge spaceship hide behind the cloud when Moses had his people out in the Desert? Are not *rods* tools used by higher entities and which they had developed? What about Roswell, is this all manufactured as well? What about the Starchild project? He insists that he has a skull that is part alien and part human, and he is out there trying to prove this scientifically, because the bone structure etc is so different to a human skull. What purpose would the dark brothers have for using implants of memories etc of space craft, to scare humans? Wouldnt it just make us humans even more curious rather than frightening, unless of course, they want us to think that the aliens are one day going to attack Earth? Why would they want us to think that? Anything is possible, so I like to keep an open mind on all these subjects. Cosmic Girl 46042 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 05:57:12 -0000 From: "T. Rob B. Jr." trobbjr75@... Subject: Re: ETs Part II nirvanastarseed@y... wrote: JJ seems to be saying that we are the ones ahead here, and that things are so new there is hardly any life out there at all up to our level. I don't see how you could come to the conclusion that this planet is some how more special or ahead than the rest of the universe Rob: I didn't come to that conclusion. I'm talking about what JJ said which was: "Physical self conscious life dwelling on the surface of a planet with technology more advanced than ours is rare in the universe. The only ones capable of interstellar flight are members of the Brotherhood...." And also he said: "We are ahead of many sister planets because we have had more stimulation from advanced lives." Thus from these statements was my question of "what makes us so special" generated. nirvanastarseed@y... wrote: I see our development the other way around. If anything we are the ones behind. In all likelihood, there is probally thousands of civilizations out there. Most of them ahead of ours. It makes more sense if you think about it. We are rather primitive. Rob: And you see it this way why exactly? Rob 46043 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 08:11:24 -0000 From: "Cosmic Girl" womanofoz8@... Subject: Re: ETs Part II Rob: And also he (JJ) said: "We are ahead of many sister planets because we have had more stimulation from advanced lives." Thus from these statements was my question of "what makes us so special" generated. I have been thinking today also, about this same question, Rob. If Earth is the Sister Soul Planet of Venus, then we became special compared to the other planets in our system, because of this one event in Earth's history, which connects us to Venus. An interaction perhaps, between Venus/Earth, Sun/Moon or even Venus, Sun, Earth, Moon. I guess I would have to read a lot more of DK's writings to put more together, and as this could take me a very long time, I can only try and expand my own ring-pass-not on this subject and the whole issue of aliens and Gods etc. As the Morning Stars or first Lucifers came to Earth, for some reason, I dont know about as yet, and one fell etc etc, then it was important enough for the Ancient of Days who came from Venus(?) to stay with the Earth as an aide to God of/as the Earth? Although what could be more intriguing than even Aliens and UFOs, to us from a human point of view, than our own Selves, and exploring, studying and endeavouring to understand the concept of us as Gods, because in essence, from everything I have been learning, in reality humanity is the consciousness of a higher being or rather God, and if you really delve into this aspect of yourself, aliens seem to be just part of the whole movie that is playing out in God's mind then perhaps? Take away all *form* and layers of US and there we stand naked as a continuously manifesting conscious state of a higher entity or God, who is, as the Planet Earth, becoming more through the learning of Divine Love/Wisdom of an even higher entity, and through the understanding of the Earth and us as God/s in this state of consciousness that works through us all as Soul perhaps, then doesnt this make each one of us a thoughtform of energy just waiting to become more light-filled with Divine Love and Wisdom, through our understanding of God and His understanding of us and Himself? Once most people can truly understand and comprehend this concept of ourselves as being *conscious* and perhaps even unconscious states of existence within the mind of a higher being, who works through humanity who are the throat centre for His being, and as the throat produces sound, then aliens seem to pale in comparison to the mere hu-man. We are like the voice of God on Earth, representing His thoughts. This God has a wealth of knowledge and experience and information to work through within us. This makes the Earth a bit more special than the other planets that are waiting for that same response and interaction from all of us in humanity, who will one day, or rather, in millions of years, may be able to help uplift them, as the Ancient of Days has helped Earth. (This Earth is still only a small and tiny speck in the bigger scheme of the All, as we are told.) I also noticed that JJ refers to these planets as *sisters*. Are all planets, the female aspect, because they are *matter/form*? Is the Spirit the male aspect and therefore stimulates the female aspect? You may find this an interesting read: http://www.crystalinks.com/sanatkumara.html Cosmic Girl 46044 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 10:48:04 -0000 From: "Lawrence Kennon" lkennon@... Subject: Re: ETs Part II nirvanastarseed wrote: JJ seems to be saying that we are the ones ahead here, and that things are so new there is hardly any life out there at all up to our level. What is the scientific evidence? My understanding is that astronomers have spent four or five decades at least looking for any signs of intelligent life and have not found any so far. One would have thought that if this part of the galaxy was brimming with intelligent life similiar to our own that there would be some evidence in the form of radio waves that are not just the "reverberations" of creation and natural processes? In all likelihood, there is probally thousands of civilizations out there. Most of them ahead of ours. It makes more sense if you think about it. We are rather primitive. It seems to me that you have taken what you start out with as a probability and escalated it into a certainty? :) lk www.theNewAgeSite.com 46045 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 10:04:53 -0000 From: "humata" Humata@... Subject: Re: ETs Part II nirvanastarseed wrote: JJ seems to be saying that we are the ones ahead here, and that things are so new there is hardly any life out there at all up to our level. I don't see how you could come to the conclusion that this planet is some how more special or ahead than the rest of the universe, I see our development the other way around.If anything we are the ones behind. In all likelihood, there is probally thousands of civilizations out there. Most of them ahead of ours. It makes more sense if you think about it. We are rather primitive. Daniel: Perhaps what was meant was that mastery in our denser reality is considered "advanced", as overcoming here contains a potential for development in a straight line to the highest level; something not available on so-called "higher levels". Certainly the environment and group consiousness is less here than on levels where consciousness is not so profoundly affected by denser energies. But the muscle developed here is well beyond what can be developed elsewhere, and earth existence is considered a privlege on the other planes. Incidently, the planes on which ET's seem real, and travel between planets is possible, up to and including travel to the Central Sun at the galactic core, and the Divine Pair there, are all second heaven experiences, and are based on identification with and as a body, and are not the formless or mental realm spoken of. All this is more of an illusion, when seen from the Formless Level, than even the illusions associated with dense Earth existence. I am not familar enough with Baileys system to place these levels of beyond the body experience within it, but Blavatsky in the Voice of the Silence refers to the Three Halls (or Worlds) which correspond to the three heavens of the Bible. The Hall of Ignorance she states is "The phenomenal World of the Senses and of terrestrial consciousness only." The Voice of the Silence calls it " The Hall in which thou sawest the light, in which thou livest, and shalt die." The Second is called the Hall of Learning, which she states is the "astral region, the Psychic World of supersensuous sights... the great 'Astral Serpent' of Eliphas Levi.... It is the world of the Great Illusion." The Voice of the Silence says, "In it thy soul will find the blossoms of life, but under every flower a serpent coiled." "The name of the Third Hall is Wisdom, beyond which stretch the shoreless waters of Akshara, the indestructible fount of Omniscience." Blavatsky states that this is "The region of the full Spiritual Consciousness beyond which there is no longer danger for him who has reached it." The Voice continues: ' If thou woulds't cross the first Hall safely, let not thy mind mistake the fires of lust that burn therein for the Sunlight of life. If thou woulds't cross the second safely, stop not the fragrance of its stupefying blossoms to inhale. If freed thou woulds't be from the Karmic chains, seek not for thy Guru in those Mayavic regions... Seek for him who is to give thee birth in the Hall of Wisdom, the hall which lies beyond, wherein all shadows are unknown, and where the light of truth shines with unfading glory. That which is uncreate abides in thee, Disciple, as it abides in that Hall." The Hall of Wisdom corresponds to the Causal Plane in Shankara's teachings, the Dharmakaya in Buddhism, the Mental in Percival, and Sushupti (or the deep sleeping state) in yoga. Turiya, which represents the fourth is actually the union of all three, Jagrat (waking), Swapna (dreaming), and Sushupti, in the Light, and is called the World of Knowledge, or Union with God. These three also correspond to Body, Speech, and Mind, in buddhism, or the three realms or kayas. The purified versions or bodies of these are termed Nirmanakaya, Sambhogakaya, and Dharmakaya. Or the Physical, Psychic, Mental and Noetic. What is "seen" in the Hall of Learning is largely a projection of one's own unconscious, according to one's conditioning, except one sees it represented concretely through the senses, more vibrantly than on earth. So if one believes in Christ, or Krishna, in ET's, Angels or Nagas, or even if one doesnt believe, but this is the catagory of the experience to the subconscious, then one will see apparent entities through the senses that represents the experience you are having to your subconscious. That doesnt mean the contact or experience or beings are not real, as the contact can be both real and important, but all is not what it seems. If you take the sensory information as real then you are in severe illusion. If you question with your mind and heart, discriminating, you will rise to the clear light. Works like the Tibetan Book of the Dead, and the deity visualization work of Vajrayana are all based on learning this discrimination between the apparent images of the Sambhogakaya state, and the formless realities (what you would call Principles) of the Dharmakaya. JJ's visualization of the conference of masters who want to question him on his writing of a "fictional" work, is most likely of this category. That doesnt mean that all that transpired is untrue or unreal, only that experience from the third heaven, or Hall of Wisdom is quite different from this. As Paul says, I knew a man caught up to the third heaven whether in the body or out or the body I dont know, only God knows. This identifies the level of the experience, and makes perfect sense if you understand it is formless. At that level one enjoys omniscience, and a body of bliss (joy), but no senses or sense body except on levels beneath that awareness. Daniel 46046 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 05:07:25 -0700 From: J J Dewey jjd@... Subject: 1947 I remember seeing a documentary that talked about ancient artwork (and more recently but before 1947) depicting objects that resemble present-day descriptions of aircraft of unidentifiable origin. This doesn't jibe with your no-ufo-sightings-pre-1947 theory. JJ On hindsight a handful of possible UFO sightings were made before 1947, but after the first one was nationally reported in 1947 (by Kenneth Arnold from Idaho) then the number of such sightings increased a hundred fold. In other words, when people's imaginations were stimulated, their imaginations created more sightings. A while back there was a group in Boise who would meet weekly and always see UFOs. I was curious so one week I went along with them. We all looked up in the sky for a while until one of the group said "there's one," pointing her finger at the sky. I looked up and said, "That's not a UFO, that the planet Venus." The group seemed downcast after I spoiled this sighting and saw nothing while I was there. When I left I felt that if I did not correct the lady that the whole group's imagination would have been triggered and they would have seen all kinds of things as they usually did. Then another time there was a guy who lead a group to UFO sightings who claimed to be able to call them down and talk with the captain of the ships telepathically in the process. I never did get in on this bunch. Rob JJ, you say that people from other planets fold their bodies up into the spiritual in order to transcend the speed of light, but they can only do this with their own bodies. They can't transport other things like seeds and animals for which they would need ships. Well that explains why the Avatar of Synthesis can't manifest physically-- we've been visualizing him with clothes on! lol :) JJ They have the technology to do this with their ships also and all that is within them. Rob What makes us so special that, out of all the trillions of planets in the universe, advanced lives would want to pay attention to us for the purpose of stimulating our growth? What'd they do, draw from a lottery and it just so happened to be earth's lucky day? JJ I never said that we are one out of trillions. I said that planets with advanced technological life is fairly rare. There are still quite a few in the galaxy, but it will take a lot of searching for the SETO program to find another like earth. The ones that do exist will eventually populate the neighbor worlds. We will cross the ocean of space and find new worlds occupied by natives just as we crossed the ocean on the earth and found what we saw as primitive people. Rob You wrote: "chances are [the ships] came from this solar system rather than outside of it." What would be the purpose of ships traveling within our own solar system? What are these ships doing/transporting? JJ Research, vacation, curiosity etc. Rob What was so special about the year 1947 that people started reporting seeing UFOs at that time but not previous? Why not 1847? JJ This was shortly after the development of the atomic bomb. Neighboring lives are paying more attention to us, but the sightings also stimulate the imagination creating many false sightings and contacts. Many are also deceitful, looking for attention. Rob What would be the purpose for etheric beings visiting humans while they're in a quasi-dream state? JJ Most of these instances are imaginary, but the ones that are not are probably for research of some kind. Tob Do crop circles have anything to do with the UFO phenomenon? If not, what causes them (the unexplained kind, not the man-made kind)? Rob JJ I've not sought the answer to this as it is a low point of interest to me. If I had to guess I would say they have nothing to do with UFOs. If ETs are using these to communicate with us they are doing a poor job for no one I know has received a usable message from them. Don't let life discourage you; everyone who got where he is had to begin where he was. Richard L. Evans Copyright 2004 by J J Dewey 46047 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 13:14:17 -0000 From: "Cosmic Girl" womanofoz8@... Subject: Re: ETs Part II God knows. This identifies the level of the experience, and makes perfect sense if you understand it is formless. At that level one enjoys omniscience, and a body of bliss (joy), but no senses or sense body except on levels beneath that awareness. Daniel Wow Daniel, Thanks for this explanation! I tried to read HPB once, but it was really hard for me to get into her style of writing, however, you have explained it much better. Thank you, Cosmic Girl 46048 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 07:42:22 -0600 From: "Mindy" burgem@... Subject: RE: 1947 I'm curious if anyone has any thoughts on the Dogon tribe's folklore. According to their legend, amphibious, half man, half serpent type beings, which they call Nommos, came from Sirius to teach them many, many years ago. The Dogons supplied accurate data on this solar system plus the Syrian system before our telescopes had the capacity to confirm their knowledge. "They called the Nommo 'Masters of the Water', 'The Monitors', 'The Teachers or Instructors', 'Saviors', and 'Spiritual Guardians'." Mindy JJ On hindsight a handful of possible UFO sightings were made before 1947, But after the first one was nationally reported in 1947 (by Kenneth Arnold From Idaho) then the number of such sightings increased a hundred fold. In other words, when people's imaginations were stimulated, their imaginations created more sightings. 46049 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 13:43:01 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: OT Master KH Cosmic girl wrote: ".....drawing souls by the sacred sound that is *God* out of the ASTRAL plane into the ETHERIC retreats of the Brotherhood." Is this pointing out that the souls are *trapped* within the Astral realms, and therefore, by playing the sacred sound that is God, those souls that are mildly still conscious of God are drawn out of the astral realms via that music and are then drawn into the etheric retreats of the Brotherhood for preparation and further advancement in consciousness into another incarnation? John: Here is a great quote from the Sag meditations which Glenys posted. If we are trapped, it is because of our own doing. "Right use of thought, restraint of speech, and consequent harmlessness on the physical plane, result in liberation; for we are held in the human unit, we are imprisoned to the planet not by some outside force that holds us there, but by what we ourselves have done. The moment we no longer set up wrong relations with people by the things we say that should not have been said, the moment we stop thinking things about people that we should not think, little by little those ties that hold us to planetary existence are severed, we are freed and we climb the mountain like the goat in Capricorn". The Labours of Hercules, p 161, Lucis Press. 46050 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 06:20:04 -0800 (PST) From: "bryan a. smith" smithgiant@... Subject: JJ's Quote For The Day "He who stands in the true middle is seen as an extremist by the real extremists." -- JJ Dewey The above quotation was taken from: http://thenewagesite.com/jjdewey/archives/article.php?num=1114 46051 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 15:48:58 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: OT tech biz Robert wrote: Yes John, it does. Thanks. one more if you don't mind, is this how search engines work? There's a new type of search enging coming out -- the desktop search engine. I'm not really sure how they work, but I have to believe that they download programs to the client, and these programs search the hard drive and index your emails and web pages. I am still testing this out, but if it works the way I think, I should be able to do a Google search on the AAB website which I have downloaded to my computer. I have been looking into other alternatives besides the Google desktop. The comments I read on the web say that they all download adware and spyware onto your machine, so I'm leary of using any of them. As for web search engines, like the standard Google, they have programs which scour the web and store everything in a central database. When you do a Google search, you are really querying their database. The database is not always up to date, and this is why there are so many bad links. All this software runs on their server. Your client browser is simply a means of typing in your query and displaying the results. 46052 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 12:04:08 -0000 From: "oneconnection1" oneconnection1@... Subject: One Connection OT I am not sure if what I would like to share is appropriate as I Am, new as as a keyster member! One Connection To Wholeness Awakening! Remembering! Sets All free to consciously manifest The True Nature Of All things! Interconnected Being of Loving Oneness. "Oneness" manifested through the channel of physical form expressing the true nature of all things on the earth plane. Life As A Human Being, Is but a process of awakening experiences that inevitably highlight the Real source of A Human Forms Authentic Nature. Life as it is known is but a process of awakening to what we always have been & eternally will be. Loving Sparks of Divine Consciousness interconnected with all that is & all that is perceived as not. Sparks that reflect the essence of the One Self. The I Am Presence. Consciousness! Perceived through time & conditioning as Individual Manifestations of differing tangible physical forms. Male ~ Female ~ Emptiness ~ Fullness ~ Light & Dark ~ Positive ~ Negative ~ Both the Observer & the Observed ~ The Product & Producer ~ The Puppet & Puppeteer. All co-exists as One. No Me ~ No We ~ No Us ~ No them ~ No Separate-Ness. Only the innate essence of "Supreme Oneness" All Encompassing Consciousness All Knowing ~ All Love. A Pure Essence of Being. A Universal Presence Interconnecting & Encompassing the Totality of Perceived Form & Formless Expressions. Reflecting ~ Expressing ~ Experiencing & Evolving Into the One Source. Divine Self ~ Godhead, Buddha, Father Mother God, giving birth to All that is, having no beginning and no end. An infinitely expanding ever ~ present source existent within the ever present moment. A divine will unifying all life and nourishing creation through a beneficial power of eternal & infinitely expanding Love. Namaste: Diane Kirk. 46053 Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 22:05:07 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: OT One Connection oneconnection1 wrote: I am not sure if what I would like to share is appropriate as I Am, new as as a keyster member! John: You must be really new. You don't show up on the membership roster yet. But, I think it usually takes a day or two to show up. If you are in doubt as to whether what you are posting is appropriate, my advice would be to lurk for a few days; find out what is taught here and how it is taught; find out what your fellow members are posting. Also, read some of the messages from previous days. The focus here is on the study and understanding of eternal principles and laws. We believe in using our minds to the fullest, but we also believe in developing intuition or soul contact. This quote says it quite well: "The intuitive mind is sensitive to and can respond to the soul. It can only be developed as the mind is controlled and the illusions it contains dissipated. In fact, it has been called the opposite of illusion 'remembering that illusion imprisons a man upon the mental plane and surrounds him entirely with man-made thoughtforms, barring out escape into the higher realms of awareness or into that loving service which must be given in the lower worlds of conscious, manifested effort'. Alice Bailey, 1950, Glamour: A World Problem, Lucis Trust , P.136 (Thanks, Glenys for this quote.) See: http://www.worldservicegroup.com/gl-sagittarius-2004.html We are working on a two-pronged approach here: (1) Learn how to master the mind by developing the ability to discern between truth and illusion, and (2) Learn how to develop a sensitivity to the soul so that intuition can flash forth in our minds. The current topic under discussion in the Reappearance of Christ. We are reading chapters from the book of the same title by Alice A. Bailey. JJ Dewey is our teacher, and is leading us in the discussion. He is also working on his book The Immortal Part IV. We haven't seen any new chapters lately, but more should be coming out soon. Once in a while we get sidetracked onto other discussions. Currently we are talking about a new invention that one of our members, Rick, has, and his plans to patent his invention and set up a company to manufacture it. We are also having side discussions on ET's and UFO's, and on the roles of various Masters. Every day, Bryan posts quotes from JJ Dewey. I find them to always be quite good. I would also recommend reading Glenys' full moon meditations. Especially, her article. I personally don't care much for astrology, but Glenys' articles are so well-written and logical, that she has almost made a believer out of me. Open the post and follow the links. To try this link: http://www.worldservicegroup.com/gl-sagittarius-2004.html If you want to post anything else not on topic, please include "OT" in the subject line. Also, the moderators request that we limit ourselves to one OT post per day. So, welcome to the group. We have some very interesting people in this group, as you'll find out, though things have been rather quiet lately. You'll get a lot more out of your experience here if you participate, and join in answering JJ's discussion questions. John 46054 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 15:04:18 +1300 From: Glenys Lowery jewelinthelotus@... Subject: Sagittarius Full Moon Commentaries Hi everyone Just to let you know that two further commentaries can be found at www.worldservicegroup.com Joann Bakula - Sagittarius 2004 letter: Keyword: Direction Phillip Lindsay - Sagittarius: The Sound of Silence Further details on full moon meditations and a meditation format for the Keysters can be found in the Keyster file section. Much love Glenys Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see. Arthur Schopenhauer 46055 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 03:07:03 -0000 From: "nirvanastarseed" nirvanastarseed@... Subject: Re: ETs Part II ok that was interesting reading that, and I could go on for a long time about why I believe what I do. I know I didn't make a strong case and people might think they are advanced but we really arn't that advanced at all. Generally we don't even know the definition of advanced. We have not mastered water, or the air, or any of those things. We have begun to explore them. We have only begun to explore technology, but we can't handle the level we are up to spiritually anyway. And politically we are a mess, environmentally we are a mess. We are a mess in general. What is taught in schools is 'wrong' compared to what we should be teaching (in the context of what we say we want to become as a society) We havn't even mastered simple concepts like 'the truth' and 'treat others how you would like to be treated' and then you think we can claimed to be advanced as a society? we can't even feed everyone. or stop killing them. we done and achieved alot but in the context of the rest of the universe I think we have a long way to go. and I know there is probally not life right next to us that we can see in our telescopes. But ofcourse there would be 'other life' 'more advanced' and if you want evidence about other life, there is alot of it. how much evidence do you need? photo's. movies, artifacts. witnesses. books. it;s all there. just do the research. anyway my point is. I dissagree with what JJ said because, it doesn't seem likely with all I have researched and looked into that there is hardly any life out there, and just about none as advanced. 46056 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 08:59:33 -0000 From: "Rick Audette" rick1@... Subject: PXL/floating city stuff decided Well, after much deliberation on to patent or publish, I have decided to release the principle of Pneumatic Crystal Lattices to the public domain. Initially, text disclosing the principle and various means of employing it, with photos and illustrations, will be incorporated in a Microsoft Word document. Later, the material will be made available in book form, to help get myself into the PXL business. Once the information is made public, I, or anyone else, will be free to make and sell them. Having no start-up capital of my own, means my imagination is my only head start on the competition. Hopefully, some visionary company will enlist me as a partner, but I see many potential ways of earning a nice living by promoting and selling PXL's. This new technology has been an open topic with Keys, since we first started having Gatherings. I wasn't able to attend this year, but I heard JJ predicted floating cities of light, in the next few decades. Wow! That makes PXL's sound like a foundation upon which a Kingdom will be built. I'm honored, but would be even more so if I could endow mankind, starting in this forum, among my brother and sister, fellow seekers of knowledge. In other words, I'm asking that the subject of PXL's be accepted as "On-Topic" on "The Keys of Knowledge". I seek no advantages. We are all one Mankind. But, hopefully, if you ever hear of me living alone, in a hotel in N.Y., with only a pigeon for a friend, you'll come bail me out of that scene, LOL. Happy Thanksgiving, We thank you Father... Rick 46057 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 09:26:48 -0000 From: "Rick Audette" rick1@... Subject: Re: One Connection oneconnection wrote: OT I am not sure if what I would like to share is appropriate as I Am, new as as a keyster member! One Connection To Wholeness Awakening! Remembering! (snipped) Namaste: Diane Kirk. Sounds resonable, but can you put it into your own words and do you understand how to put it into action in the earthly realm? Rick 46058 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 03:22:53 -0600 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: RE: Re: ETs Part II Hmm. All that "evidence", and you still have nothing more than a "belief". This is the same place we always get whenever we discuss this topic. It becomes a matter of personal belief because there is not enough evidence to prove or disprove anything. I suggest we move on to more fruitful areas of discussion. nirvanastarseed wrote: ok that was interesting reading that, and I could go on for a long time about why I believe what I do. ...how much evidence do you need? photo's. movies, artifacts. witnesses. books. It's all there. just do the research. 46059 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 03:01:33 -0700 From: J J Dewey jjd@... Subject: ETs Part III Sterling: Here's another question. In my previous theology (prior to ET conviction -- by which I mean a firm belief that they exist and that they are pertinent to our planet and to our spiritual advancement at this juncture in history), I anticipated a time in our not-to-distant future, in fact I believed it would happen in my lifetime, after our purging by calamity, group humiliation and divine redemption, a new society on this earth -- one which Joseph Smith called a return of the paradisiacal glory, the Edenic state but with enlightenment. I believe that state will be devoid of a telestial level manifestation on the earth because as a group we will have evolved collectively from being telestial to being terrestrial (born of the spirit, though not necessarily overcoming all things to a "Celestial" level, though there will be many souls of a celestial level among us, indeed the "church" that provides spiritual leadership to the planet in its continual group evolution will be of a "Celestial" advancement). In that advanced state, I envisioned free commerce between angelic and divine beings with humans in the flesh -- "heaven on earth," as it is called theologically. JJ The LDS, as well as most Christians, believe that there will be a great spiritual change when Christ comes. Either the earth will be changed into a paradise like Eden (after great destruction of the wicked) or the righteous will be taken to some paradise after the earth is destroyed where the wicked burn in hell. This will not happen as expected (and the future will bear me out on this) but there is a seed of truth in part of this. If the disciples of the world do their part then the earth will be turned into an Eden compared to what it was 2000 years ago when the predictions originated. In fact, the quality of physical life is an Eden today in the wealthy nations compared to live 2000 years ago. Imagine taking one of the disciples of Jesus into our age and taking him to supermarket where he could buy products and produce from all over the world. Then take him for a ride in a car and plane. Next take him home and show him how you cook on an electric stove and in a microwave. Finally settle down with him and watch a football game and movie on TV. This disciple would be amazed indeed and may feel he has entered a paradise beyond that which he imagined existed. But, if we do not blow ourselves up first, this is just the beginning. A couple hundred years of additional progression will make tremendous progression so eventually all the world can have relative abundance and become a paradise compared to times past. The question is: What about the great spiritual difference that is supposed to come when Christ comes? Aren't we getting worse spiritually rather than better? It is an illusion that humanity, as a whole, is deteriorating spiritually rather than progressing. Those who think so are not examining the evidence of history. Let us look at the practices of ancient Israel who were more advanced spiritually than their neighbors. After they conquered their enemies they often completely destroyed all the men and took the women and children as wives or slaves. If they had a disobedient child who did not behave it was within the law to kill them to eliminate the problem. Killing gays as well as witches was commanded. If someone disobeyed the Sabbath they were to be put to death. Having sex with your daughter and polygamy was no big deal. Women were seen as property and had few rights. Now this was the condition of the righteous. The neighboring countries were much worse. They sacrificed children to idols, and tortured their victims with much more cruelty than the Israelites, who merely killed their enemies. Up until a few hundred years ago all wars were wars for conquest where the winner sought the property and land of the conquered. This changed in the 20th century. In World Wars One and Two all the democratic winners wanted was for the subdued nations to behave themselves. After World War Two we left West Germany, Japan and Italy much better off than their original state while not stealing their land or taxing them. Later we did the same thing with South Korea and now (if we succeed) we will do the same with Afghanistan and Iraq. This is unprecedented progress for humanity. DK makes the interesting point that the Red Cross, that we take for granted, is an organization that could not have existed just a few hundred years ago. This and other benevolent organizations can only exist today because of the advance in the spiritual consciousness of humanity as a whole. Now admittedly, there are always a minority of the human race who are of a low spiritual order and are capable of as great of atrocities as the worst of them from the past. Saddam Hussein grinding up dissidents in a meat grinder or dipping them in acid for entertainment is a good example. But, overall, humanity has moved forward spiritually, not backward. That said, the progress continues and when Christ comes again he will take the most advanced of humanity and teach them. These will be the seeds of the new race, sixth root race or the consciousness of the terrestrial or paradisiacal glory. This sixth root race will be gathered and synthesized out of all the races and is more related to consciousness than it is physical features. It will take many thousands of years for this paradise through higher consciousness to reach its apex as it spreads throughout the earth. As this consciousness progresses there will be a great increase of communication with the lives in the higher ethers and the spirit world. Then, several million years in the future the final race will appear which will be the divine hermaphrodite, the merging of male/female energies. This will inaugurate the celestial consciousness of the earth where the inhabitants will seem like Gods compared to humanity today. Sterling So, here's the question or point. If we as a planet are so inferior spiritually at this time to some of the advanced ET races that fly around our galaxy and universe, and our next, pending, on the brink step of advancement is to mingle freely with God (the diving hierarchy that oversees our planet, with one male-female couple at its head) and with angels in our midst, you would think that those ET races advanced from ours would already be at that level of commingling with God and angels -- and therefore that angels and divine beings, being in their midst, are aboard their air craft, instructing, discussing strategy -- if not visibly ever present, at least spiritually manifest. JJ Remember this. Cortez and his men were much more advanced technologically than were the American Indians, but which were more advanced spiritually? Cortez gave them cheap beads. They gave him precious gold. They shared, he plundered. Even so with ET's. It is entirely possible that many of them are not that spiritually advanced - unless they have mastered the spiritual technology necessary for interstellar flight where they can materialize in the physical. This takes a high degree of spiritual evolution to accomplish. It is not the job of ETs to teach us or to save us. This must be accomplished by humanity itself and teachers who evolve from humanity. Those who are expecting a fleet of spaceships to show up and save us from ourselves are deceived. Before there can be any public interplay with ETs we must first reach a much higher degree of spiritual progress. If we get in a crisis we must fall back on the teachers of the race guided by the Spiritual Hierarchy of Christ and his disciples. Sterling asks how other dimensions and universes effect us theologically. JJ The higher planes of our own world effect us, but the fanciful other universes and dimensions has about as much direct effect on us as the Andromeda Galaxy presently has on your consciousness - which is negligible. All lives wherever they are working are on their next step in progression just as we are. Sterling Who are they (the ETs), theologically? JJ Who are we? The answer is the same. Sterling If our awareness of our visiting ET neighbors can help solicit their mediation in keeping us from blowing ourselves off this planet, then an understanding of who they are theologically is invaluable. Furthermore, if some of the ET neighbors hanging around have malevolent designs on us, viewing us as mere chattel for harvesting and slave labor, using our world governments to exercise such control over us, then soliciting the assistance of the benevolent faction would be appropriate, to level the playing field. JJ No physical ETs are in on a conspiracy to control the earth and they are not in cahoots with the government, but the Dark Brotherhood is in this system and some are cooperating from other systems. These operate through subtle communications and influence and not as Ets, except as impersonating them if it serves their purpose. Sterling If our planet is slated for wipe-out in 2012, by an asteroid on a fixed course, for example, and life will be as impossible here thereafter as it is on mars now, and an escape is necessary, then it seems that soliciting benevolent ET assistance in preparing for some sort of exodus would be prudent. JJ Our planet will still exist as is after 2012 though there will be points of tension.. The main thing we have to fear is ourselves and disciples need to work with solving problems more than expecting the end of the world, or being saved by ETs. Sterling My theology does not see the earth becoming permanently uninhabitable after 2012. I do believe that the earth will be transformed, and that 2012 could be a purging event that does the trick. JJ The transformation will be one of slow and steady progress (with a few spurts forward and backward) rather than a giant purging that leaves only the spiritual minded left. If there is a giant World War III then many of the good and bad will be destroyed leaving a mixture of the good and bad left over to struggle for power again. Sterling, All things physical have a spiritual counterpart, and vice versa. The earth went though a physical baptism by water with the flood of Noah. It will go through a physical baptism of fire in the days not far ahead -- in our lifetime, I believe. JJ The real baptism of fire is very far into the future, but we could have a minor one before the new age. One of the problems with prophesy is that the visionary will often see far into the future as if it is the present and write about it as if it will happen tomorrow. When seeing through the cycles of time it is difficult to predict in real time when events will manifest. The visionary must descend to his concrete mind anchored in time and put everything together. Sterling I cannot help but think that that baptism will require every bit as much of an escape vehicle as those who survived the flood of Noah had an escape vehicle -- complete with seeds and animals to repopulate the earth after the baptism by water. JJ Of much greater concern (in the category of natural calamities) for the immediate future is the coming ice age. The earth has one about every 11,000 years and one is due soon. Some think it will begin anytime. I think it will start within 150-200 years. This gives us some time to prepare for gathering the lights into floating (as well as possible airborne) cities on the oceans where they will be out of harm's way of this and other earth changes. Sterling, So also, I would think that there will be an escape vehicle humungous in scope, to repopulate the earth after its baptism by fire. Some individuals may be spirited elsewhere, transplanted. But I would think that the ideal fate of our group evolution would be to stick around here and repopulate Earth. I cannot fathom that such a feat could be accomplished without the assistance of advanced ET races willing to assist. JJ It is up to the Hierarchy of the earth to guide and save us. If we destroy ourselves then we will have to start over. It is unlikely all human life will be destroyed even if we do our worst. If this were to happen we could then be reseeded or stimulated by the Brotherhood from other systems. Sterling What about the cities that were taken up -- Enoch, Salem, Melchizedek -- with a return slated after the earth is cleansed? Was the purely a function of a divine miracle moving people and soil? Where did they go? Or were there ET races involved in those transplantations, moving a whole society from this planet because they had transformed high enough spiritually? JJ I believe the city of Enoch was not physically taken into heaven. The truth is indicated in this scripture: "And he beheld, and lo, Zion, in the process of time, was taken up into heaven. And the Lord said unto Enoch: Behold mine abode forever." Moses 7:21 Notice, that it was through "a process of time" that the city was taken into heaven. If a large land mass were merely removed and translated this would have been a quick occurrence. Why did the ascension of Zion take a process of time and why is it called God's "abode forever" if it is only a terrestrial order? The answer is that the people who resided there achieved spiritual liberation and either died or ascended to the spiritual city of the New Jerusalem which John tells us in Revelations is God's abode. Those who find the Heavenly Jerusalem have found the city of Enoch. After a period of time when all the lights of the city died or ascended then it seemed that Zion was no more or it had fled and only the telestial order of the dark and dreary world remained. Sterling Did they (Ets) have a Jesus Christ in their past history? Did they have a Moses? Did they have a Noah? An Adam? A Joseph Smith? A latter-day David? An anti-Christ? 666? How ubiquitous are these motifs in the progression of civilizations elsewhere in the universe? JJ Each Earth-like planet with intelligent physical life will have inhabitants going through a similar process of evolution to ourselves. A handful in the galaxy are ahead of us in technology and consciousness, many are behind us. In saying this, one needs to keep in mind that there have been past universes, galaxies and solar systems where previous humans achieved relative perfection and mastery of the physical worlds. However, in this round of creation human evolution is yet young in the universe. Our Elder Brothers from a past round are now our Gods and tutors . The earth is one of the few physical planets who have received extra stimulation from liberated masters of past creations. The inhabitants of each planet eventually receive soul contact and one in particular will master Soul and Spirit to become an example to all of the Christ consciousness and thus attain the position of Christ on the various worlds. Many humans have similar experiences and also different ones in the course of their evolution, even so do the races of the various planets. In the end (of their evolution) they all learn the same lessons and come to the same conclusions. Sterling: On a general progression chart, how far along are we in relation to the Extraterrestrials involved heavily with our planet? 1st grade? 5th? JJ If, by Extraterrestrials you mean all people living on the various planets whether they fly in spaceships or not the answer would be we are in the top 95%. If you are only talking about ETs in ships which includes those in the etheric matter then our state of progression is much lower by comparison. Sterling What sort of technologies can they bring to us as we engage them? Health remedies, energy solutions, transportation solutions, pollution remedies, spiritual teachings? JJ Virtually none. All progress we have made is due to our own efforts and the efforts of the Masters to assist us. The current crop of Masters have all come from this earth or been here for some time. An exception to this is after times of great destruction there will be assistance in seeding the earth for renewed growth. There is one great truth from the Star Trek series and that is the Prime Directive. The great lives in the universe have learned that the less they help the better is the end result and the more profound is the learning of the various people on the varied planets. One of the dangers we face on earth, because of the little assistance we have received, is that we now have the capacity to blow ourselves into the stone age but not the maturity to insure we will exercise the proper self control move safely into the new age. With a little luck we hope to move into a new age of peace and avoid an end of the world scenario that so many accept as out fate. Perhaps the most valuable result of all education is the ability to make yourself do the things you have to do, when it ought to be done, whether you like it or not. It is the first lesson that ought to be learned. Thomas H. Huxley (1825 - 1895) Copyright 2004 by J J Dewey 46060 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 10:33:58 -0000 From: "rainbowcal2001" rainbowcal2001@... Subject: Re: Sagittarius Full Moon Hi Glenys, You know, I've not cared much for Astrology. Not that I don't think it worthwhile but all the talk about Moon, Jupiter, Uranus etc ascending or descending or in one house or the other have never really registered coherently in my mind so I've kept clear of it until now. Just out of curiousity because I am a Sagittarian (DOB December 12th) I decided to read the commentaries starting with the Aunty Alice ...... but left it part way and went to yours and boy I really enjoyed it. Perhaps this time I'll participate in the Full Moon Meditations and subsequent ones. Arit 46061 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 11:01:00 -0000 From: "rainbowcal2001" rainbowcal2001@... Subject: Re: PXL/floating city stuff decided Rick: Well, after much deliberation on to patent or publish, I have Decided to release the principle of Pneumatic Crystal Lattices to the public domain. Hi Rick, May you be richly blessed for your decision. I don't know much about this stuff but I have a good feel about your decision and I believe because of this you'll be propelled to greater heights materially and spiritually. May your imagination expand even more and may the Masters find you a worthy partner in this great work which you've begun. Arit 46062 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 11:38:46 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: OT - Dream about Thought-forms This post is OT, and it is for exactly this reason why I requested that there be some leeway in regulating the number of OT posts per member. I read the material which Glenys posted yesterday about the Sagitarius Full Moon meditations, and it stimulated me to have a dream last night. I am posting information about the dream because, although it is not relevant to the topic at hand, it is relevant to the general discussion we are having on the Keys. I often have dreams where I am sitting in a classroom, being taught one-on-one by a teacher whom I cannot identify, but I know he is there showing things to me. It's not a one-way lecture. It's interactive. He'll ask me questions and I'll answer them, or I'll ask him questions, and he'll direct me to where I can find the answer. We are seated around a table, and on the table is a device which, if it were built in the awakening world, would be a most amazing device. It is a blackboard; a book; a 3-dimentional computer; and what's more, it's a device which you can actually enter into with your mind, and experience the lessons as virtual 3-D reality. It works through the power of my mind and shows me anything I want to see, that is relevant to the lesson being taught. I had such a dream last night. I woke up from it, then fell back asleep, and the dream resumed. I was being taught about thought- forms. I looked at them from several different points of consciousness: above, below, same level. They looked different from each angle. They appeared as tangible objects to me. The best example I can think of would be flying in an airplane looking at clound. When you are flying below a cloud, they block out the view from above. When you are flying through a cloud, the ride is very bumpy and you have trouble seeing anything around you. When you are flying above a cloud, they don't seem very substantial, and you wonder why something so whispy and insubstantial can block your view and buffet you about so much. Fixed thought-forms are the result of fixed energy -- energy constantly diverted from other purposes to keep the thought-forms alive. Thought follows energy and energy follows thought. There is a mutual dependency here. It takes energy to create a thought-form, and since the thought-form was created, it will also have an end, so we have to keep feeding it energy to keep it alive. It is possible to lavish so much care and concern on a thought-form that it was take on a life of its own, and starts demanding to be fed. We can embue a thought-form with a consciousness of its own; we can place our attention on that consciousness, identify with that consciousness, and see it as our own; forgetting that it was we who created it; and forgetting that it is not really us, but a remote viewpoint which we have created. The idea of "being", at this level of consciousness, tends to fix the thought-forms into ridges of energy. The idea of "becoming" tends to keep these thought-forms in motion and keeps the energy flowing. It takes an expenditure of energy to stop the flow of energy. Normally, energy would flow freely throughout all the universe, but we mistakenly think there is a shortage of energy, so we attempt to capture it, rather than let it flow through us. But, in order to do this, we need to set up an opposing stream of energy. The result is a lot of wasted energy directed against itself and serving no other purpose. Think what we could do with all that excess energy which were are pouring into feeding our illusions. But, like Nacrissus, we can become so enamored with our reflection that we dive into the water, doomed to never find our true self. Energy opposing energy creates a ridge, or a problem, or solid matter. Two opposing forces are equally matched, and therefore hold each other in place. The solution to this dilemma is to stop feeding energy to each side. But, if we did that, we would stop "having" something, and we have the mistaken belief that having something, even if it is illusory, is better than having "nothing". This view seems to make sense, until we get a view about the "clouds". Then we take a different view. So, are thoughts-forms bad? Are they evil? Do we want to get rid of all of them? The short answer is no. We all live in this world even though the goal is to lift all of us to a higher consciousness. A higher view would tell us that some of us can rise a bit above our fellows (such as in the Hierarchy), but that is nothing in the eternal scheme of things, and humanity must rise together, or not at all. Since this is a group effort, we all either rise together, or we fall together, so we need to help pull each other out of glamor and illusion. A better approach might be to learn how to understand illusion for what it is, but still use it to help pull others out of illusion. When you are buried under a pile of rocks, you can climb your way out using the rocks. In other words, your trap is also your means of escape. Rick is a scientific researcher. I tend to see myself as a spiritual researcher. While he is building a foundation of the kingdom based on buildings which will float above water, I am interesting in building a foundation of the kingdom based on principles which enable the soul to float upon and navigate the treacherous waters of maya and illusion. John 46063 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 12:04:42 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: Sagittarius Full Moon Hi Arit, Guess what, my birthday is Dec. 11. I read all the meditations and kept thinking "this is me", but I also kept thinkinging that people with this kind of nature (Sag's) probably don't care much for astrology. I wonder if there are any studies on which particular sign is the most common for people who closely follow astrology. But, that is probably a very Sagittarian thought, and a "true" astrologer would never base his findings on actual evidence. (Sorry if this remark offends anybody. It just appears to me that astrology is more arbitrary and not based on evidence and research. I could be wrong.) We did an informal study at one place where I worked. Half of all the programmers were Sagittarians! We'll have to remember to wish each other a happy birthday. John rainbowcal wrote: Just out of curiousity because I am a Sagittarian (DOB December 12th) I decided to read the commentaries starting with the Aunty Alice ...... but left it part way and went to yours and boy I really enjoyed it. Perhaps this time I'll participate in the Full Moon Meditations and subsequent ones. 46064 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 12:08:54 -0000 From: "Glenys Lowery" jewelinthelotus@... Subject: Re: Sagittarius Full Moon rainbowcal wrote: Hi Glenys, You know, I've not cared much for Astrology. Not that I don't think it worthwhile but all the talk about Moon, Jupiter, Uranus etc ascending or descending or in one house or the other have never really registered coherently in my mind so I've kept clear of it until now. Just out of curiousity because I am a Sagittarian (DOB December 12th) I decided to read the commentaries starting with the Aunty Alice ...... but left it part way and went to yours and boy I really enjoyed it. Perhaps this time I'll participate in the Full Moon Meditations and subsequent ones. Hi Arit From the point of view of the disciple, esoteric astrology is about the relationship between the soul and the personality so studying it can be a great help to us as we walk the Path. I try to reflect that in my commentaries so it was a joy to hear that you found my Sagittarius commentary useful - and a double joy to know it might just get you doing full moon meditations. All the information on how to get involved is in the Files section but if you would like further information, do let me know. In the meantime, I hope to see you on the inner in about 32 hours when the Sagittarius full moon take place :-) . Love Glenys 46065 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 10:54:11 EST From: BTrodlier@... Subject: Re: ETs Part III Bil David Writes: I know this may not be popular to some of you who read this post; however, it is my opinion and perception that it may not be necessary for mankind to move toward a 6th or 7th root race. I am not convinced either that the Christ will come as has been described in recent post and take the most advanced of the seed races and teach them or even start the 6th root race from that higher conscious seed. It is my opinion, for I know that we all have one or we would not be posting our thoughts, that the universe is moving toward simplicity not more complexity. If this is true then there would be no reason for humanity to move toward a 6th or 7th root race. It is not just Earth moving toward simplicity. It is the Universe moving toward Simplicity. Look at your individual lives. I am sure that most of us who are honest with oneself would say that deep down there is a move toward living life with more simplicity. This energy move is deep seeded and resides within each one us including other occupants of the Universe where ever they may be or what state of existence they choose. It is my opinion also that this move started in the mid 1990's. After reading my opinion and post, I welcome your comments. Happy Thanksgiving, Blessings 46066 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 16:14:10 -0000 From: "Lawrence Kennon" lkennon@... Subject: Re: ETs Part III JJ wrote: Remember this. Cortez and his men were much more advanced technologically than were the American Indians, but which were more advanced spiritually? The Spaniards may have not been more spiritually advanced, but I doubt they were less spiritually advanced (and an argument could certainly be made that the western civilization the Spaniards represented was indeed spiritually superior, despite the cruel and callous treatment displayed by the Spaniards in regards to the native Americans). Cortez gave them cheap beads. They gave him precious gold. They shared, he plundered. I seem to recall that the S. Amerian indians that the Spaniards first encountered may have been somewhat disarmed by their own theology and legends. The Aztecs, for example, seem to have been expecting some sort of "white gods" to come. Therefore at first they indeed thought that the gods had arrived and treated the Spaniards whom they mistook as "gods" as you described. However any examination of cultures like the Aztecs will tell you that they still practiced human sacrifice and were quite capable of extreme cruelty equal, and perhaps even surpassing, that of the Spaniards. So they probably got from Cortes exactly what karma decreed. :) lk www.theNewAgeSite.com 46067 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 16:16:21 -0000 From: "rainbowcal2001" rainbowcal2001@... Subject: Re: Sagittarius Full Moon John C: We'll have to remember to wish each other a happy birthday. Arit: Hi there John C. No wonder I always read your posts first. Little did I know we were of the same star sign. To quote Glenys, "I hope to see you on the inner in about 32 hours when the Sagittarius Full Moon takes place." Any other Sag out there? Join us. I believe non-Sags are also invited. 46068 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 08:34:37 -0800 (PST) From: "bryan a. smith" smithgiant@... Subject: JJ's Quote For The Day "If one truly desires a quantum leap in spiritual evolution for his brethren, let him set up an ensign and remember the ancient law that we become as that which we gaze upon, or that which draws our attention." -- JJ Dewey The above quotation was taken from: http://thenewagesite.com/jjdewey/gathering/chapter38.php 46069 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 10:51:44 -0600 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: RE: ETs Part III I'm not seeing the connection between simplicity and complexity on the one hand and evolution to the 6th or 7th root race on the other. I'm assuming you feel that complexity is synonymous with evolution and simplicity is synonymous with devolution. I disagree. Christ is a lot more evolved than we are, but since He has mastered so much more, life is simpler for Him. I know life has gotten a lot simpler for me once I resolved a few inner conflicts and stopped fighting battles I didn't need to fight, and started paying attention to what matters most. If we evolve any further than we are now, we're not going to evolve a more complex body. We perfected the form in the last cycle of evolution. The new direction of evolution will be towards group cooperation. This is the goal, however, I don't see how that can happen when people can't even communicate with one another. But, there are groups making progress in that direction, so there's still hope. When you say the "universe", are you referring to the physical universe, or to the lives within that universe? The physical universe tends to spiral downward and seek a state of equilibrium because of entropy, but evolution runs counter to this by creating ever advanced life forms. The human physical body is no more complicated than that of a chimpanzee. In fact, we share 90% of the same gene pool. It is the spirit within which differentiates us. Christ is not going to start the 6th root race. I believe that JJ has taught that it will be the Ancient of Days. He will return, incarnate as another "Adam", or in other words, the holder of that office, and will father the bodies of that race. But all this aside, I still have the sense that we are going to succeed, despite the fact that I don't see any evidence around me to support this. I am sadly afraid that along with the possible ice age which JJ is predicting, humanity is slipping back into superstition and barbarism. JJ asked the question once whether when Christ came would it be the dawn of a golden age, or a salvage operation. My friend Thom thinks the salvage operation is going on right now; that the harvest has long past; and the last 2000 years have been a gleaning of the fields. I tend to be more of an optimist. And, as for the human race not being ready. Certainly as a whole the human race is not ready, but not all students progress at the same rate, and the teacher reaches a point where he has to decide whether to continue holding up the entire class for the laggard, or to let the bright students advance, and send the less brighter students back to remedial class. I believe this decision is being pondered at this time. John Bil David Writes: I know this may not be popular to some of you who read this post; however, it is my opinion and perception that it may not be necessary for mankind to move toward a 6th or 7th root race. I am not convinced either that the Christ will come as has been described in recent post and take the most advanced of the seed races and teach them or even start the 6th root race from that higher conscious seed. It is my opinion, for I know that we all have one or we would not be posting our thoughts, that the universe is moving toward simplicity not more complexity. If this is true then there would be no reason for humanity to move toward a 6th or 7th root race. It is not just Earth moving toward simplicity. It is the Universe moving toward Simplicity. Look at your individual lives. I am sure that most of us who are honest with oneself would say that deep down there is a move toward living life with more simplicity. This energy move is deep seeded and resides within each one us including other occupants of the Universe where ever they may be or what state of existence they choose. It is my opinion also that this move started in the mid 1990's. After reading my opinion and post, I welcome your comments. 46070 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 17:57:53 -0000 From: "melvakeys" melvakeys@... Subject: OT Soul Contact/Contemplation/Visualization I have been contemplating Soul Contact. To that end, I have been letting various visualizations flow by my Mind's Eye. One visualization that has stayed with me over the past few weeks is: Picture an hourglass. Picture Soul Light in the top of the hourglass. Picture personality in the lower portion of the hourglass. I then picture the Light of the Soul reaching towards the personality and the personality reaching up. I picture parts of the personality illuminating with the Light of the Soul. This is good, eh? Then as I am watching this ebb and flow of Soul Light and feeling enveloped and calm... Then I see aspects of the personality rising up to the space between the Light of the Soul and the personality... and I see those aspects of my personality clogging (not the dance Rob taught us in Wimberly) that narrow passage. It seems to take a fair amount of time to Light up those dense aspects of my personality/lower self. Since it seemed, to me, that those dense aspects were taking so long to "Lighten Up"... I thought maybe I should determine exactly what they were made up of and that perhaps in the act of sorting... Light would flow through them more easily. That's where I'm at in my visualization process this Day of Thanksgiving, 2004. Giving Thanks Happily, Melva 46071 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 18:08:26 -0000 From: "melvakeys" melvakeys@... Subject: Re: 1947/Folding/Unfolding JJ comments: people from other planets fold their bodies up into the spiritual in order to transcend the speed of light, but they can only do this with their own bodies. The human body has a physical corallary to this ability: Proteins fold and unfold. For a protein to be utilized, it must be in an unfolded state. There are several states a protein goes through in the unfolding process. (My point is that our bodies are going through the folding/unfolding processes [and as far as I am concerned: uncountable] multiples of many times a day. On a cellular level we "know" how to fold/unfold our cells.) An aside: one of the possible causes of Alzheimers has been thought to be the improper unfolding of prions (a type of protein) in the brain. Melva Happy Giving of Thanks Day to all 46072 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 12:58:00 -0700 From: J J Dewey jjd@... Subject: Larry's Point You make some good points Larry. Both sides were far from innocent and which was being more primitive is a judgment call. I think Cortez did surpass the Indians in sheer greed and negative intent. In fact, he was one of the most barbaric of the explorers from the old World. JJ Remember this. Cortez and his men were much more advanced technologically than were the American Indians, but which were more advanced spiritually? The Spaniards may have not been more spiritually advanced, but I doubt they were less spiritually advanced (and an argument could certainly be made that the western civilization the Spaniards represented was indeed spiritually superior, despite the cruel and callous treatment displayed by the Spaniards in regards to the native Americans). Cortez gave them cheap beads. They gave him precious gold. They shared, he plundered. I seem to recall that the S. Amerian indians that the Spaniards first encountered may have been somewhat disarmed by their own theology and legends. The Aztecs, for example, seem to have been expecting some sort of "white gods" to come. Therefore at first they indeed thought that the gods had arrived and treated the Spaniards whom they mistook as "gods" as you described. However any examination of cultures like the Aztecs will tell you that they still practiced human sacrifice and were quite capable of extreme cruelty equal, and perhaps even surpassing, that of the Spaniards. So they probably got from Cortes exactly what karma decreed. :) lk www.theNewAgeSite.com 46073 Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 01:03:19 -0600 From: Gail Raby graby@... Subject: Re: ETs Part III Bil David Writes: " it is my opinion and perception that it may not be necessary for mankind to move toward a 6th or 7th root race."....and..."the universe is moving toward simplicity not more complexity. If this is true then there would be no reason for humanity to move toward a 6th or 7th root race"----and----"this move started in the mid 1990's. Gail wrote: What specifically would make this not necessary? What do you you mean by "moving toward simplicity" and if this is so, how would it negate the need for or advantage of becoming whatever would happen as we achieve that higher root race status. And what event(s) at the exoteric observible level happened in the mid 90's and what was the causal energy behind it that initiated and heralded this move to simplicity. g 46074 Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 00:35:45 -0700 From: J J Dewey jjd@... Subject: Thanksgiving Hope all U.S. residents had a good Thanksgiving and hope the rest had a thgankful day. One of the differences between the light and dark brotherhoods is a spirit of gratitude and thankfulness to God in the hearts of of those on the right hand path. Those on the left only appreciate that which the lower self can do. Copyright 2004 by J J Dewey 46075 Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 09:44:21 -0000 From: "Lawrence Kennon" lkennon@... Subject: Re: Larry's Point JJ: I think Cortez did surpass the Indians in sheer greed and negative intent. In fact, he was one of the most barbaric of the explorers from the old World. "For the sake of policy, Cort?s was, in general, far from cruel towards the Indians. He allowed Cuauhtemotzin to be tortured in order to force him to reveal the whereabouts of his supposed hidden treasures. Such acts were not uncommon at that period, and every nation was at times guilty of them. ... To the Indians as a mass he was kind. He recognized that their preservation would insure eventual prosperity for the Spaniards, provided the Indians gradually accepted European ideas. Therefore he regarded the Church as the main instrument for the education of the Indian." Catholic Encyclopedia http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/04397a.htm "It is estimated that approximately 20,000 people per year were sacrificed by the Aztec royalty. Captives were taken to the top of pyramids where, upon a ritual flat stone table, they had their chests cut upon and their hearts ripped out. Then the bodies of the victims were tossed down the steps of the pyramids. The scene to both the Spaniards of that time and to us today is truly gruesome." ... "The victims of these ritual slaughters were usually warriors captured by the Aztecs in battles or tributes from vassal states in the form of humans offered up for sacrifice. This is why the Aztecs never fully conquered many of the surrounding states. They needed a steady supply of ritual sacrifice victims. If they used their own people for sacrifice then it could cause an uprising." ... "There was another reason for these ritual sacrifices---cannibalism. After the hearts were removed and the bodies tossed down the temple steps, the limbs were removed and later cooked. As repugnant as cannibalism is to us today, back then to the Aztecs, cooked human bodies were looked upon as great delicacies which explains why only Aztec royalty, not the common people, were allowed to engage in cannibalism. The favorite parts for the Aztecs to munch on were the hands and thighs. The Aztec emperor, Moctezuma, was reported to have been partial to cooked thighs served with tomatoes and chili pepper sauce." http://nv.essortment.com/aztecsacrificeraif.htm lk www.theNewAgeSite.com 46076 Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 09:27:05 EST From: IAMmgd@... Subject: Re: Thanksgiving Happy Thanksgiving to everyone!! Love, Maryellen 46077 Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 07:19:13 -0800 (PST) From: "bryan a. smith" smithgiant@... Subject: OT: ET's Part I, II, II; et al JJ: In the following post you made on 01/15/99 found at: http://thenewagesite.com/jjdewey/archives/article.php?num=164 ...you state: (among a host of other interesting things, including an interesting revelation concerning the correspondence between 'black holes' and the biblical/scriptural reference to 'the bottomless pit') "Over 99% of alien encounters are either a deception or illusion of some kind, a fabrication or some type of hypnotic effect." END QUOTE Because this topic/subject is so heavily 'engrained' into our consciousness (in a 'knowing' that such things are 'in fact' possible), and understanding how this topic (about UFOs, etc) has the potential to be a *most* powerful tool of deception) is there any 'specific knowledge' as it relates to this topic or a way that we can apply the knowledge which you have offered in other 'areas' to insulate us (individually or more importantly as a group of humans; i.e., mass deceptions) from being 'deceived' (and/or deluded)? I ask as while I, like many others, would like to believe (and do) that 'we' could not be deceived by such things, and while that may or may not be the case, I also have come to the realization that many can, do and are--to include those that may be in positions of authority/power which could, in-turn make statements or decisions which could seriously or significantly influence and/or affect us in many ways (to include 'deception thru association'). If the answer is that we are 'safe' as long as we use whatever level of 'soul contact' ('inner authority') to validate these things (unexplainable phenomena) just as we would 'validate' *any* 'input', then fine. Additionally, if it is that all 'we' have to do is to 'teach/present the truth' about these things (as is done for other subjects/topics relating to 'unexplainable/difficult to explain phenomena'); then again, fine. I'm looking for things that might be characterized as 'hints, tips and tricks' and something aside from 'it's nothing to worry about'. Are you presently aware of any evidence that these types/kinds of 'illusionary/deceptive' are being actively employed to influence 'leaders in government' and other 'groups' which have or are in positions of power/authority which could or are affecting us? Because we can assume that 99% of these 'encounters' are to be considered 'fake', can we then also assume that The Brotherhood of Light, also knowing this, would then not (ever or openly) use these 'tools' as a means of 'revealing' themselves? Meaning, do we need to actively concern ourselves with the potential 1% of the time that these things *might* be 'true' and need to receive our attention/consideration? Regards Bryan "A great deal of learning can be packed into an empty head." (Karl Draus, 1874-1936) 46078 Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 07:22:06 -0800 (PST) From: "bryan a. smith" smithgiant@... Subject: JJ's Quote For The Day "The Law of Correspondences can be used to support most anything if the logic is flawed and points that do not correspond are said to correspond. If the reasoning is sound it points the way to many truths." -- JJ Dewey The above quotation was taken from: http://thenewagesite.com/jjdewey/archives/article.php?num=2579 46079 Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 18:08:33 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: OT: ET's Part I, II, II; et al Bryan, Please, can we all decide to get back on topic! I don't know as I'd agree that this UFO stuff is "deeply ingrained in our consciousness". This stuff doesn't even touch my consciousness until somebody brings it up on the Keys, then discussion of spiritual principles which can enhance evolution are shelved while we entertain suprious theories. I love Science Fiction as much as anybody. I have read all the great Sci Fi authors, and when a good movie comes out, I go see it. (I'll even go see the Star Wars movies, although they consistently disappoint me.) I also agree that Sci Fi authors can offer visionary and sometimes prophetic glimpses into the future. The prospect of ET's is tantalizing, but it's also like candy for the mind -- we fill up on empty calories, while the real food goes untouched. I don't know what's wrong with the principles of using discernment, discrimination, dispassion, thought, and intuition to determine the truth or falsehood of any and all propositions. ET's and UFO's are but one more area where we can apply these principles. Why should they be considered a special case and treated differently? I suggest we stick to topics which we can prove or at least demonstrate to ourselves or to one another. Soul Contact is a great example. It can be proven; it can be demonstrated; a teacher can show a student the path to achieving Soul Contact; and the student can walk that path and see the results for him- or herself. If somebody could demonstrate a means for me to verify the existence of ET's on the physical plane -- a means which is equally as reliable as the path to achieve Soul Contact, and where the results of following that path are not subject to ambiguous interpretation, or to blind belief, then I would be extremely interested in hearing about it and trying it out for myself. But, as long as the so-called "evidence" for ET's lies in the realm of faith and belief, with no way to prove or disprove the proposition, then in my opinion, it is a waste of time and mental energy to pursue such a belief. JJ has offered a plausible explanation for this phenomena. This is not a burning issue with me, but for those who are concerned with it, use whatever Soul Contact you have developed up to this point to find out the answer for yourself. If you don't have any Soul Contact, then perhaps your concern over this issue would lead you to a point of tension to where you could develop the necessary contact and achieve the desired answer. I am NOT saying "don't investigate UFO's". We should investigate anything and everything which comes into our purview. So, if you are out there doing constructive research, then please continue doing so, for you are doing humanity a great service. And when you have evidence which you can demonstrate to conclusivly prove or disprove this proposition, then please present it. What I fear, however, is people who have already come to a conclusion and are seeking only evidence which only supports their conclusion and ignoring everything else. It is also possible for two people to look at the same results and come to a different conclusion. What I am saying is I think it is silly and a waste of bandwidth to keep discussing ad infinitum things, which for which we have no conclusive evidence, on the Keys when there are more productive topics which we can discuss and also when there are unanswered, on- topic, questions still lying on the table. What more can we learn about Hilarion, and H.K.? What't the next chapter in AAB? Are we through discussing chapter 3 and the reappearance of the Christ? What about the Third Key? What about Chapter Ten? John There are a lot of website where we can learn about interesting "facts" and discuss whether they are true or not. This is the Keys of Knowledge group. What I am interested in learning here is how to acquire the Keys by which I can obtain a knowledge of principles, and then using those principles, learn for myself whatever facts interest me, or are necessary to know. (Sorry, it's just me shooting arrows and pursuing goals.) 46080 Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 21:47:54 -0000 From: "smithgiant" smithgiant@... Subject: Re: OT: ET's Part I, II, II; et al John C wrote: Bryan, Please, can we all decide to get back on topic! If nothing else, I can almost always depend on you to speak up and speak your mind (grin). And agree how distracting and downright frustrating it can be when others post what *I* happen to believe are/is not only 'OT', but cause situations where, as you pointed out, the "...discussion of spiritual principles which can enhance evolution are shelved while we entertain suprious theories." I, for one, am thankful that this communication format offers the option of "skip, ignore and/or delete", and when so 'irritated' by others who *I* believe are not following what *I* consider to be the 'rules of common sense', I do just that--and yet do not believe that I have felt compelled to publicly correct or 'chastise' them for posting an 'OT' message. I believe I have consistently demonstrated an ability to censor/restrain myself not only in this regard, and from my dim memory believe that this I have (on average) only posted one "OT" post per week, and even while this particular thread began as 'on topic' (by virtue of JJ's post); I, understanding that this post may be considered as "OT", did place "OT" in the subject line. Whether it makes any difference to you or others or not, please know that since this topic was brought up by JJ in response to Sterling's questions, that I first waited to see if anything to the effect of what I spoke about was brouhgt up/disicussed, and to the best of my knowledge it has or was not done so as I expressed it. And in the meantime wrote various 'approaches' which I thought were either 'too OT' or contained far too many 'personal items' (spurious theories?-- big grin) to warrant posting either as 'on-topic' or even 'OT'. And yes, it may be true that I should have continued to not post what I had written, and felt that I had finally 'boiled it down' enough and crafted it enough to at least get it approved as 'OT'. And placed 'OT' in the topic as not to convey that I intended to 'hijack' the on-topic posts made of this subject, and posted it fully aware that JJ and everyone else had the option of ignoring it. I don't know as I'd agree that this UFO stuff is "deeply ingrained in our consciousness". This stuff doesn't even touch my consciousness until somebody brings it up on the Keys, I too consider myself as one of those that is not so inclined to hold some of the more popular views (or spurious theories) about this topic. I readily/willlingly admit that I have no 'facts' as to the numbers of those who have this topic 'deeply ingrained in their consciousness', and (rightly or wrongly) made this statement/assumption simply based on the vast array of anecdotal interest/information on the topic, which is by virtue of the existence of interest it gathers *is* 'a fact'. I love Science Fiction as much as anybody. I have read all the great Sci Fi authors, and when a good movie comes out, I go see it. (I'll even go see the Star Wars movies, although they consistently disappoint me.) I also agree that Sci Fi authors can offer visionary and sometimes prophetic glimpses into the future. The prospect of ET's is tantalizing, but it's also like candy for the mind -- we fill up on empty calories, while the real food goes untouched. I agree with your statements as it pertains to the world of Sci-Fi and ET's--to include the disappointment, and agree as to their 'value' and consequences of 'over-indulging'. However, I am curious as to how it is that you have come to the conclusion that 'we' have now 'had our fill', or that you believe you are in a position to be able to accurately discern what it is that is 'best or good' for us to focus on as it relates to this or other "OT" posts? And, supposing for just one moment that you had the ability to accurately discern such things (as to what we should or shouldn't be focussing on) that by following your admonitions on this that we are assured that there would be any benefit from either considering it or not? Or, that what you had to offer is somehow 'more clear' as opposed to anything that anyone else would have to offer by way of questions/comments on this topic or any other topic? I don't know what's wrong with the principles of using discernment, discrimination, dispassion, thought, and intuition to determine the truth or falsehood of any and all propositions. ET's and UFO's are but one more area where we can apply these principles. I agree, and as I stated in my post, I was both willing and able to take *that* as an answer. And, if either it is the general consensus of 'the group' *and* if someone on the order of a recognized/earned authority such as JJ states this or agrees with this, then I have no problem accepting it. Why should they be considered a special case and treated differently? Excellent question. And this is what I believe is or was the crux of, or the basic intent of my question. As I was and am unsure as to whether this does or does not warrant 'special consideration'. On one hand, I can see that how it may not. And on the other, I can see how it might require 'special handling'. I apologize if I am unable to discern which is the case. I suggest we stick to topics which we can prove or at least demonstrate to ourselves or to one another. Soul Contact is a great example. It can be proven; it can be demonstrated; a teacher can show a student the path to achieving Soul Contact; and the student can walk that path and see the results for him- or herself. If somebody could demonstrate a means for me to verify the existence of ET's on the physical plane -- a means which is equally as reliable as the path to achieve Soul Contact, and where the results of following that path are not subject to ambiguous interpretation, or to blind belief, then I would be extremely interested in hearing about it and trying it out for myself. But, as long as the so-called "evidence" for ET's lies in the realm of faith and belief, with no way to prove or disprove the proposition, then in my opinion, it is a waste of time and mental energy to pursue such a belief. Excellent example and one with which I completely agree with you on. Are there then other examples of 'non-provable' or topics which require, or where only 'faith, belief, ambiguous interpreations, blind belief, etc., which, in your opinion are a waste of time and mental energy to pursue, but which are pursued here at The Keys? And can we count on you to apply this same rule of measurement, and to speak out when these 'empty pursuits' are engaged in? And, when others apply the same rule of measurement to you and others, that you will be able to accept 'the measurement'? JJ has offered a plausible explanation for this phenomena. I agree that he has, and thru my own (previous) studies of this topic had come to some very similar conclusions--sans the method by which the Brotherhood of Light are/were involved. This is not a burning issue with me, but for those who are concerned with it, use whatever Soul Contact you have developed up to this point to find out the answer for yourself. If you don't have any Soul Contact, then perhaps your concern over this issue would lead you to a point of tension to where you could develop the necessary contact and achieve the desired answer. This issue doesn't really burn, nor consume me to any degree either. And, while I am in complete agreement with your comments as it relates to soul contact and using a point of tension, I can't help but wonder how much would be offered or what level of interest there would be if we were required to do this for everything outside of learning to use soul contact/point of tension to "develop the necessary contact and achieve the desired answer" to all those topics outside of soul contact. I am NOT saying "don't investigate UFO's". We should investigate anything and everything which comes into our purview. So, if you are out there doing constructive research, then please continue doing so, for you are doing humanity a great service. And when you have evidence which you can demonstrate to conclusivly prove or disprove this proposition, then please present it. What I fear, however, is people who have already come to a conclusion and are seeking only evidence which only supports their conclusion and ignoring everything else. It is also possible for two people to look at the same results and come to a different conclusion. Agreed, and you express the same 'concern' that I have or had, and was hoping somehow to address those things that I *know* I have heard others express 'conclusions' about--and was *not* necessarily expressing *my* concern or conclusions. Guess I just have to chalk another one up to "a failure to adequately/clearly communicate", eh? (grin) Oh well!? What I am saying is I think it is silly and a waste of bandwidth to keep discussing ad infinitum things, which for which we have no conclusive evidence, on the Keys when there are more productive topics which we can discuss and also when there are unanswered, on- topic, questions still lying on the table. Agreed, and also please refer up above to my comments as it pertains to what is/isn't/may/may consider as "productive", etc. What more can we learn about Hilarion, and H.K.? What't the next chapter in AAB? Are we through discussing chapter 3 and the reappearance of the Christ? What about the Third Key? What about Chapter Ten? I agree...and am willing, ready and able to learn about these and much more. There are a lot of website where we can learn about interesting "facts" and discuss whether they are true or not. This is the Keys of Knowledge group. What I am interested in learning here is how to acquire the Keys by which I can obtain a knowledge of principles, and then using those principles, learn for myself whatever facts interest me, or are necessary to know. Hmmm, well here I thought that I was interested and doing the same things. And guess I need to beg the apology of everyone here for not being as "evolutionarily advanced" as the rest of you, and for not knowing or being able to discern 'what's important and what's not.' Wouldn't be the first time--doubt it'll be the last. Regards Bryan 46081 Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 22:14:29 -0700 From: "Sterling D. Allan" sterlingda@... Subject: (OT) One man's bad news is another's good Rockslide on I-70, boulders the size of a van, smashed 6 feet into highway at places, tore through bridge. Road happened to be closed at the time due to an overturned truck a mile away, was about to be reopened. How many times in life is our bad news good news for someone else? The trucker who overturned was having a bad day, but he probably saved a lot of lives. http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/11/26/rock.slide.ap/index.html 46082 Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 06:05:37 -0000 From: "Cosmic Girl" womanofoz8@... Subject: Re: ETs Part III JJ wrote: "Of much greater concern (in the category of natural calamities) for the immediate future is the coming ice age. The earth has one about every 11,000 years and one is due soon. Some think it will begin anytime. I think it will start within 150-200 years. This gives us some time to prepare for gathering the lights into floating (as well as possible airborne) cities on the oceans where they will be out of harm's way of this and other earth changes." Okay, I have a few questions about this coming ice age vs blowing ourselves up....... Obviously because of the Cycles in Time, the Earth is due for an ice age, which I take that as meaning, that the Earth is once again flooded like the time when Noah had his Ark for example? Therefore if this cycle comes around again, and there are no floating cities etc, that means humanity is wiped out then, doesnt it? If humanity blows itself up before this coming cycle of flooding or where the oceans rise, then what's the difference, when the Earth will inevitably be changing through the coming ice age anyway, and if we are not prepared for it, then we are history? It seems that either way there is the probable possibility of an ice age where everything is wiped off the face of Earth, or there is the destruction by humans where everything is wiped off the Earth. If humanity was destroyed and the seed was planted once again somewhere else(?), then does humanity's consciousness come back again at the same level it left the other planet i.e. does humanity have to start from the very beginning again, even though the consciousness level had been raised from animal man, to some degree, or does humanity have to relearn these lessons all over again? If the Soul retains all experience and knowledge, then why wouldn't humanity be able to come back into that body where it left off on another planet, etc? Just wondering on this scenario........... For what it's worth, regarding ETs, I think that anything that is outside the *norm* of most peoples' ring-pass-not, makes for great discussion, even if its fantasy or real, as its the experience of delving into the unknown and asking questions and using the imagination that helps one expand one's own consciousness. (I've finally come to the realisation that I shouldn't be so impatient and in a hurry for *things* to happen, because I have the rest of eternity for these *things* to happen, and learn.) Cosmic Girl 46083 Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 08:26:10 -0000 From: "Glenys Lowery" jewelinthelotus@... Subject: Re: OT One Connection Hi John I'm in catch-up mode and just spotted this great kindness :-) What can I say except my usual 1000 hugs, O (Almost) Believing One! :-) Love Glenys I would also recommend reading Glenys' full moon meditations. Especially, her article. I personally don't care much for astrology, but Glenys' articles are so well-written and logical, that she has almost made a believer out of me. Open the post and follow the links. To try this link: http://www.worldservicegroup.com/gl-sagittarius-2004.html Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it has to be us. (lololol) Jerry Garcia, (of the Grateful Dead) 46084 Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 11:20:59 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: ETs Part III Cosmic Girl wrote: For what it's worth, regarding ETs, I think that anything that is outside the *norm* of most peoples' ring-pass-not, makes for great discussion, even if its fantasy or real, as its the experience of delving into the unknown and asking questions and using the imagination that helps one expand one's own consciousness. There is a big difference between studying the unknown and studying the untrue. This is not a "great discussion" group. This is not a group dedicated to studying fantasy. This is a one-of-a-kind group dedicated to studying the Keys of Knowledge. I, for one, am not just sitting around and waiting for this group to fulfill its stated purpose; I am demanding (if I may use that term in the same sense that DK uses it) that this group begin to fulfill its stated purpose. (I've finally come to the realisation that I shouldn't be so impatient and in a hurry for *things* to happen, because I have the rest of eternity for these *things* to happen, and learn.) One thing which you and Catherine from Scotland don't seem to understand is that staying on purpose and being in a hurry are not the same thing. Haste makes waste, but so does activity without intelligence. A parable about Sagittarius. The hunter, riding through the woods on his house carries his fine bow and a few choice arrows. He needs to bring home food for his starving family. He doesn't waste time riding about the woods, making noise and scaring the animals away. He doesn't waste arrows shooting at rabbits and squirrels. He finds the spot where he knows the deer are wont to gather. He sits and waits patiently until he spots the deer which will provide sufficient food. He aims carefully, draws back, releases, and the arrow finds its mark. His family has meat. John 46085 Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 04:31:39 -0800 (PST) From: "bryan a. smith" smithgiant@... Subject: JJ's Quote For The Day "...do not resist posting because you feel all has been said that needs to be said. You may be denying someone else an insight that only you can deliver." -- JJ Dewey The above quotation was taken from: http://thenewagesite.com/jjdewey/archives/article.php?num=1107 46086 Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 13:36:53 -0000 From: "Cosmic Girl" womanofoz8@... Subject: Re: ETs III etc Great quote for the day Bryan, thanks! JohnC wrote: "This is a one-of-a-kind group dedicated to studying the Keys of Knowledge. I, for one, am not just sitting around and waiting for this group to fulfill its stated purpose; I am demanding (if I may use that term in the same sense that DK uses it) that this group begin to fulfill its stated purpose." CG: John, I realise this about the *group*, however, I did not anticipate JJ writing another 8 books over the next year, unless he happened to make enough money to give up all his other work and just focus on his writing. (This is when I realised that I should not be so impatient about wanting to know all the keys and principles in a short space of time, as everything runs its course or cycle according to the Soul, perhaps.) Im sure this group has been fulfilling its stated purpose over the many years it has been functioning here on the internet and will continue to do so over the next 8 or more years, or however long this journey takes to bring about molecular synthesis etc. This group is a seed germinating, whether it grows fast or slow, the sun is still shining on the seed and stimulating the growth. (I've finally come to the realisation that I shouldn't be so impatient and in a hurry for *things* to happen, because I have the rest of eternity for these *things* to happen, and learn.) JohnC: "One thing which you and Catherine from Scotland don't seem to understand is that staying on purpose and being in a hurry are not the same thing. Haste makes waste, but so does activity without intelligence." CG: Perhaps you compare me to Catherine, because of the mystic in me? :-) Other than that, why do you assume from my above statement that I dont seem to understand that staying on purpose and being in a hurry are not the same thing? Haste does indeed make waste, in some circumstances, but not all, and yes, activity without intelligence is perhaps a wasteful amount of expended energy. Im trying to learn how to expand my somewhat limited intelligence, and although practice does not always make perfect, my heart and soul are still helping to guide my brain into activity with intelligent application to somehow serve the Christ, and in doing so, not be too hasty about all my choices. I dont feel that discussing ETs is wasteful or straying from the purpose of higher learning or knowledge. Any life form or entity higher in conciousness, and living out of a human body, than a human on Earth, who may have a limited intellect and knowledge of the truth of the Soul or even Soul contact is, for me, like an extra terrestial or higher being or even a God, but thats just how I chose to deal with this information and it doesnt mean that I will automatically agree with everything JJ says or anyone else for that matter on this subject, until I have looked at the subject from all angles/views/information and not just one or two belief systems, and until my soul shows me the truth on the subject. JJ has not set another question as yet, or suggested for us to read another chapter, however, I am glad to read his thoughts on the ETs. If people write something here or ask a specific question that is important for them to understand on a particular topic or a belief of their own, and are shot down for it, or totally ignored, (and Im not insinuating that this is what you do or have done), then maybe over time newer people, and maybe even older members, will not want to post their views or thoughts. If you sat in a classroom with your hand up all the time and no-one noticed you or tried to help you out, would you still bother going to class? Yes, you can say that all we need is our Soul to guide us and be our teacher, but what happens to all the people who want to learn, but do not know how to find or listen to the inner soul? Yes, you can say just go and read the Archives, but then where is the classroom participation if everyone is just residing in the Archives? Catherine no longer posts her thoughts to topics here on the Keys, has anyone ever asked her why? Does anyone care? If no-one cares, then how does one build a synthesis group or molecular relationship if the Love of God is not being shown or felt within the group by everyone? Do these people really not count because they do not stay here or still particpate? Perhaps their soul journey takes them other places, so does this mean they are any less important to all here and what we are doing? I dont think so. Are we not all here to help others behind us, below us, above us? Perhaps I too need to re-read the introductory letter once again. Sorry to have rambled on, (I blame the full moon :-), and I will try to stay more on topic with any further input I may feel the need to contribute to this group, or perhaps go and stick my head in the Archives more, rather than add my two cents worth here. :-) Cosmic Girl 46087 Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 08:03:07 -0000 From: "oneconnection1" oneconnection1@... Subject: OT-Re-J. Craine reply one connection Thankyou for your kind gesture John., I did what you suggested & surfed around the messages, to brief myself on the process of a group & see what the group was all about. You mentioned in the email to me, that"The focus here (Keys Group) is on the study and understanding of eternal principles and laws. (J.J.Dewey) At this time I have encountered that the majority of focus appears to be on ET'S., rather than on Key's of eternal principals/laws. And that is fine, if that is what "One" is interested in or focussed upon. I Am on the earth plain., primarily with One focus., that is to "Be" All that "I am" to the best of my aware ability at this time! that means Warts & All., & to continue to learn, develop, remember & discern, what resonates with me! I Am grateful & value interacting with others who's primary focus is on Self-development/awareness. As far as, ET's/physical/or other forms, that is not an innate focus for me at present! I Am interested in Being open, sharing,learning & the interconnected study of the Principal Keys. I do realize & acknowledge, that I have developed an innate glimpse of A bigger picture over the years ., However,Not the "WHOLE" Tapestry! as it evolves eternally & infinitly expands! I AM, always ope to self-development! I Am also very content, with an innate faith & trust that "All" is unfolding perfectly by Divine Plan! I look foward to further perusal of the group & possible interaction! namaste 46088 Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 16:56:34 -0000 From: "Johann Robert Arnarsson" johannarnars@... Subject: Re: Sagittarius Full Moon rainbowcal2001 wrote: John C: We'll have to remember to wish each other a happy birthday. Arit: Hi there John C. No wonder I always read your posts first. Little did I know we were of the same star sign. To quote Glenys, "I hope to see you on the inner in about 32 hours when the Sagittarius Full Moon takes place." Any other Sag out there? Join us. I believe non-Sags are also invited. Long time we see. Just came from a two week journy to Canary were I initiated many different experiments to gain certanty in knowing, an interesting trip. Got a lot to catch up on. Were did Catherine go? Anyway I am an fellow Sagittarian and a strong one at that. If it is one thing we Sagittarians have to learn it is that other people have their missions or purpose as well and their are many different paths. We have no place judeing people for their desires, or their rate or speed of work. Besides the principles have to be lived and people are people that are in the various stages of being "built" if I use a Matrix metaphor. And that means that people have differing priorities hence we get "sidetracked" every once in a while, patience and respect is virtue, remember the tortuise (Capricorn) that finished the race before the hare? Also we have no buisness shooting people down for being "stupid". Interesting note John about the programers, a half of them being Sagittarian. Now I am studying the moon meditations on www.worldservicegroup.com Interesting stuff. We empty ourselves of knowlegde (light) before gaining new knowlegde? Run with the history repeating, no need for impatience, there are plenty of things eternally availible. I am born on Dec 4, 1971 in Reykjavik Iceland at 03:05 AM (at night) GMT. As for fun I am providing here a brief overview of my natal chart, some might find it interesting perhaps. One more thing, when things are slow like this on the Keys then I like it. Why? Because it gives time to contemplate, digest and most important to TEST! Why jump from principle to principle without interludes? It makes no sense, interludes are a part of life. Interludes do NOT mean that people are not dedicated or without focus and when we shoot people down unessiarily they can become easily discourueged because of the nature of the task. And no I am not recomending special treatment, that's idiotic. So what is the middle ground? [In tolarence] Differnt strokes for differnt folks, the right judgeing (based on understanding) of people as fruites. Fruites of experiance, the fruits that we take with us when we die for we arn't taking anything else with us. Johann Planets in signs and houses: Sun in Sagittarius 11 degrees in 3. house Moon in Cancer 5 degrees in 9. house Mercury in Sagittarius 28 degrees in 3. house Venus in Capricorn 6 degrees in 4. house Mars in Pisces 16 degrees in 6. house J?piter in Sagittarius 16 degrees in 3. house Saturn in Gemini 2 degrees in 8. house Uranus in Libra 17 degrees in 1. house Neptun in Sagittarius 3 degrees in 2. house Pl?to in Libra 2 degrees in 12. house Ascendent in Libra 4 degrees Centralsky(?) in Cancer 6 degrees South node in Leo, north node in Aquarius and the ruler of fate in Aries. 46089 Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 12:14:58 -0700 From: J J Dewey jjd@... Subject: Ice Age If humanity blows itself up before this coming cycle of flooding or where the oceans rise, then what's the difference, when the Earth will inevitably be changing through the coming ice age anyway, and if we are not prepared for it, then we are history? It seems that either way there is the probable possibility of an ice age where everything is wiped off the face of Earth, or there is the destruction by humans where everything is wiped off the Earth. An ice age would not destroy all life on earth just as it did not last time, but it would surely make life uncomfortable for some. In fact there are many parts of the earth that would remain tropical. It is estimated that in the United States most places north of about where I live in Boise would be covered with Ice. This would include cities such as Seattle, Chicago, New York as well as most of England. The interesting thing is that global warming caused by human intervention may actually make the ice age a little more palatable. There are lesser and greater ice ages. Some have come so quickly that it has frozen mammoths so fast that they have undigested food still in their mouths. I do not expect the big earth changes in our lifetime, but we must prepare so the lights of the not-so-distant future can be salvaged. The big advantage of the gathering in our time is that we have an opportunity to lay a foundation for a system that emphasizes the spiritual while maintaining maximum individual and group freedom. That's all for now. I am at work again on Book 4 and will post another chapter shortly. If I must choose between righteousness and peace, I choose righteousness. Theodore Roosevelt (1858 - 1919) Copyright 2004 by J J Dewey 46090 Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 19:01:46 -0600 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: RE: Ice Age JJ: An ice age would not destroy all life on earth just as it did not last time, but it would surely make life uncomfortable for some. John: Perhaps, some people will retreat to the Etheric physical plane until conditions become more tolerable. JJ: That's all for now. I am at work again on Book 4 and will post another chapter shortly. John: Now, you're talking. 46091 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 06:30:39 -0000 From: "smithgiant" smithgiant@... Subject: Re: Ice Age JJ: The interesting thing is that global warming caused by human intervention may actually make the ice age a little more palatable. Bryan: Probably like many here, over the past year or so, I have watched the parade of science shows which speak about how the various Ice Ages that JJ speaks of, and how historically/anciently have had the greatest impact on our evolution and even upon the physical aspects of the earth--in particular I watched one show which described just how significantly glaciers actually 'formed' most of North America. And even watched a show about 'the coming Ice Age'. I also have watched the shows on global warming. After watching several of these shows which presented 'both sides', I simply discounted both as I couldn't figure out 'who/what was right', and figured they didn't know either. Never thought that both were 'right', and that each represented 'an extreme' with 'the truth' lying somewhere 'in the middle'!? Amazing how I can be presented with 'input' like this--and even have learned what I've learned thru the teachings here and still fail to see or apply them. Then again, I don't feel so badly as with all their learning, they dont' seem to see it either. Still, it makes me wonder what else I don't 'see' as well. Appreciate you pointing out a 'middle solution' on this JJ. JJ: I do not expect the big earth changes in our lifetime, but we must prepare so the lights of the not-so-distant future can be salvaged. Bryan: Hmmm, there's that word again--'salvaged'. I personally don't like hearing that word or what it implies. JJ: The big advantage of the gathering in our time is that we have an opportunity to lay a foundation for a system that emphasizes the spiritual while maintaining maximum individual and group freedom. Bryan: While I realize that I could be reading more into JJ's comments than actually exist or that he intended, still...I couldn't resist putting things together this way... ...I first juxtaposed the word 'salvage' against the potential of the coming Ice Age, and thought that JJ may mean that the preparations and salvaging would be for and/or a result of the Ice Age. However, but then in his follow-on statement, he states that there is a 'big advantage...in our time" and 'an opportunity' versus a time yet to come in which there might *not* be the same kind of opportunity or a situation where there would/might be *less* emphasis on "...the spiritual while maintaining maximum individual and group freedom." Obviously I need to ponder this some more, eh? JohnC: Perhaps, some people will retreat to the Etheric physical plane until conditions become more tolerable. Bryan: Interesting idea, and from my limited understanding of how 'the etheric works', it would appear to be plausible, as long as these 'lights' had evolved to such a level that they could consciously/willfully (as being adepts/masters) shun their 'dense physical bodies' at will--and then back again at will. Otherwise, the only way I know they could do this would be 'to die'...unless there's some other way I am unaware of that one can 'do this' (?) This is difficult for me to 'get a reading on' because I am one who still believes that we are (spiritually) moving along at a snails pace compared to our technological evolution--and when I compare both to each other 'historically'. So for me, it would seem that 150- 200 years isn't a sufficient period of time--assuming the mid-point of the Ice Age falls within that 150-200 year period--if it falls outside of the 150-200 year period (in that the Ice Age starts sometime during that period, but the mid-point is sometime later-- then there would be more time available. Also, I must consider the 'point of tension' (necessity) that such a climatic condition would 'impose' or 'motivate' an increase in the 'rate of evolution'. Regards--and look forward to the next installment of Book IV Bryan 46092 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 08:45:25 -0000 From: "Rick Audette" rick1@... Subject: OT PXL goes public OK y'all, I've just placed a full disclosure of the Pneumatic Crystal Lattice Principle where all the world can see it, at http://www.geocities.com/rickaudette/ Let me know if you think I need more details. I will probably be expanding it as more text and illustrations develop. Rick 46093 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 08:56:01 -0000 From: "Rick Audette" rick1@... Subject: Re: Ice Age John Crane wrote: Perhaps, some people will retreat to the Etheric physical plane until conditions become more tolerable. Or, they could just stay in Texas. The weather here was pretty darn nice during the last ice age. Rick 46094 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 00:37:28 -0700 From: J J Dewey jjd@... Subject: Immortal 4 Chapter 10 My Friends, I finally have the next chapter ready. Enjoy To read the chapter please go to: http://freeread.com/Book4/Ten.htm You can find the first nine chapters at: http://freeread.com/Book4/One.htm http://freeread.com/Book4/Two.htm http://freeread.com/Book4/Three.htm http://freeread.com/Book4/Four.htm http://freeread.com/Book4/Five.htm http://freeread.com/Book4/Six.htm http://freeread.com/Book4/Seven.htm http://freeread.com/Book4/Eight.htm http://freeread.com/Book4/Nine.htm Susan Carter is in charge of the editing so if you see any typos or grammar problems write Susan at: "Susan Carter" susan@patriotsaints.com JJ 46095 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 12:23:56 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: Ice Age Smithgiant wrote: After watching several of these shows which presented 'both sides', I simply discounted both as I couldn't figure out 'who/what was right', and figured they didn't know either. Never thought that both were 'right', and that each represented 'an extreme' with 'the truth' lying somewhere 'in the middle'!? Amazing how I can be presented with 'input' like this--and even have learned what I've learned thru the teachings here and still fail to see or apply them. Then again, I don't feel so badly as with all their learning, they dont' seem to see it either. Still, it makes me wonder what else I don't 'see' as well. Appreciate you pointing out a 'middle solution' on this JJ. John: "With all their learning", is it that they can't see it, or they don't want to see it? Or they see it, but won't admit it? Science is getting so politicized nowadays that it is taking sides. And each side is slanted to their point of view. So, the normal reaction of the public would be to blindly adopt the view which fits that of their political heroes, or to throw up their hands and discount both sides. Maybe sometimes you can have it both ways. This is like asking the question: "It the best of times, or is it the worst of times?" The answer is "both", because the forces of light and darkness are each growing in strength and intensity. The earth has many physical cycles. Some of them are short enough for us to observe: hours, days, months, seasons, years. Others take hundreds if not thousands of years to accomplish. Some of these science has observed, and some it hasn't. It could be that there is a separate warming and cooling cycle and a separate cycle of ice ages, and sometimes they are in synch and enhance one another, or they are out of synch and mitigate each other to some extent. Then again too, global warming could be caused by man and is working at cross purposes with the natural cycle of ice ages, and they could still mitigate each other. When it comes to any polarizing issue, consider all four possibilities: A is right. B is right. Both A and B are right. Both A and B are wrong. John 46096 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 12:30:28 -0000 From: "Cosmic Girl" womanofoz8@... Subject: Re: Chapter 10/Immortal "Do you feel well enough to make us a hot beverage?" "I think so," she said. "How about some coffee?" "Sounds good," he said. "That would be a nice change. Where I've been lately they do not drink coffee." It would be a nice change if Joe made coffee or tea for John and Elizabeth, especially as Lizzie isnt feeling well and then she is sent out to the kitchen, and I was wondering why its always Elizabeth who has to make the tea and coffee in this series?.....is it because she is the woman or the wife, and why cant Joe sometimes make a cuppa for John and Elizabeth, or has he already? Hmmmmm... By the way, the first word that came to my mind when I read about the Key Word was REGISTER. Cosmic Girl 46097 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 14:23:32 -0000 From: "smithgiant" smithgiant@... Subject: Re: Ice Age JohnC: ...agreed...and much more eloquently stated... Regards Bryan 46098 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 14:57:42 -0000 From: "smithgiant" smithgiant@... Subject: Re: Immortal 4 Chapter 10 ...welp, I'm pleased that I 'made' myself read through the first part of the chapter, as I was *not* enjoying "the drama stuff" (personal thing)... ...and my 'persistence' or 'desire' paid off as I *really* enjoyed the second half, and how the climatic conclusion was crafted with being given all the clues to come to our own conclusion, yet not being 'given' the answer... ...nice 'use of the tools' JJ...and can see your gettin better and better at 'this' ;-) ...lots of other 'eternal words' to consider and incorporate as well... ...thanks... ...do I know the Key Word? Nope, and that's okay...and will give it some more thought and consideration, that's for sure. ;-) Regards Bryan 46099 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 07:02:04 -0800 (PST) From: "bryan a. smith" smithgiant@... Subject: JJ's Quote For The Day "Soul contact is important because the soul will never give us more change than we can handle, but the personality wants the ultimate achievement right now." -- JJ Dewey The above quotation was taken from: http://thenewagesite.com/jjdewey/archives/article.php?num=1084 46100 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 15:31:55 -0000 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: Immortal 4 Chapter 10 I enjoyed both CG's and Bryan's comments about Chapter 10. Poor "Lizzie". But, poor Joe. He just got stabbed in the stomach and was busy making a poultice to aid in its healing. When John said he had been in a place where they don't drink coffee, my first thought was: "What was John doing in Utah?" When I visit there, none of my relatives drink coffee, and mornings are hell until I go find the nearest coffee shop. A couple of quick observations. Joe heard the bells ringing, and thought it was John, but it turned out to be Philo. Can this sound be duplicated by the dark brethren? Are the bells the tone (or the musical note) which much be sounded in order for John to manifest as a physical body, as has been indicated in earlier chapters? And, if John's note was sounded, how come John didn't appear the first time? Perhaps, the bells were similar, but not identical, and that's why it wasn't John. Somehow, I also "knew" the first time Elizabeth spoke in the chapter that it really wasn't her speaking. Soul contact, or good writing? Whichever it was, the desired effect was achieved. I notice that saying "I love you" over and over again to Philo had a "disturbing effect" on him. Jesus said to love your enemies. I'm not going to elaborate on this point, but there's a key learning here. Something else to pay attention to was how Elizabeth got herself in a position to be used by Philo in the first place because of her negativity. I give her credit, though, she has been through hell throughout these books. (She might also have made a few side trips to Utah, as well, but fortunately JJ has spared us those details.) :) Interesting contrast between the two healings of Joe and Elizabeth. Of course, neither one was a complete, on-the-spot healing, but for each, the pain was eased, and they were put on the road to recovery. There is a lot of rigamaroll and hand-waving associated with healing, but John's statement in this chapter boiled it down to the bear essentials: the flow of universal energy through John and into Elizabeth. May we each learn to become pure vessels for the light so that it may flow through us and bless others. That's halfway through the chapter. I'm still working on the key word. John 46101 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 16:02:31 -0000 From: "Johann Robert Arnarsson" johannarnars@... Subject: Re: Chapter 10/Immortal CosmicGirl wrote: By the way, the first word that came to my mind when I read about the Key Word was REGISTER. Strange, the first word that came to my mind was the word confirmation. Like the resolution of the truth or the truth vibration depends upon the principle of confirmation. The theme of this whole chapter speaks volumes. And inocence is beauty which is truth. So you women that are all so beautiful and lovely, it is not much to ask to bring us a cup of coffee. After all, you are polarized in the reciving energy are you not? You have to give somthing back. LOL! And because of you are all so lovely you to snap up all sorts of conversation (reciving) with males that YOU get pick and choose from hence exercing your power of decision and staying true to your higher gravitacional light. And in termes of fruit, women's judement is terms of fruit, a bad person or a good person and therefore holds sociyity and traditions together while me men are more centered on ideas and the fruits of that ideas. Now does this ring true to you? Do you get a confirmation on this idea as being one of the etenal ideas? Does this pass the test? By the way, the whole wheelchair stuff, to me it is about standing firm and on your on in truth without loosing sight of it and the whole possesion thing...well..Do you feel loved? Johann 46102 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 17:25:04 -0000 From: "smithgiant" smithgiant@... Subject: Re: Immortal 4 Chapter 10 JohnC: Yup, must say that overall I really enjoyed the chapter.... ...AND, I even saw some 'stuff' (as it relates to form) that could even 'support' your suggestion as it relates to 'retreating into the etheric' (the Ice Age thread)... Maybe it is/was just me...but I thought I 'saw' it (?) Need to re- read it all again...and will continue to consider it...and many others things that buzzed though my mind... Regards ...and thanks again JJ... Bryan 46103 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 10:16:51 -0800 From: "Ruth Winocur" ruthangel@... Subject: Re: Immortal 4 Chapter 10 Listen, hear, CONCEPTULIZE????. then understand. Ruth W. 46104 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 19:57:33 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: Re: Immortal 4 Chapter 10 "An eternal word is a word that conveys the true idea so it will never be lost or destroyed." That is why we are studying Keys and trying to find that Key Word. I'm thinking about form-idea-principle triangle. An eternal word invokes a principle which expresses itself as an idea, which is the intelligent force which expresses itself as a form, and which maintains the existence of the form. There is a difference between the form and the things which make up the form. In the sending side of communication, I see a stepping down (those are supposed to be arrows going from the top down): | Principle | Idea v Form. On the receiving side, I see a stepping back up (arrows from the bottom up): ^ Principle | Idea | Form. Joe's steps were listen, hear, ???, understand. The "???" is the keyword which he unconsciously applied without knowing its name in order to reach the understanding that "receive" was not the key word. Combining the two (arrows from the bottom up): Understanding ^ Principle (Third Key Word) | Idea (listen) | Form (hear). Another clue is we know that Joe did something. What did he do? Joe did a lot of things. He used Attrition to shut out his other problems: the pressure of the moment, Elizabeth's condition, his mission. He also Decided to focus his Attention on the "world of the soul", so as to gain a Consciousness there, and then he did something (Third Key), the result of what he did did not confirm that "receive" was the true key word attached the principle he was learning, so using Judgment, Joe determined that "receive" was not the key word. In short, Joe used everything we have studied up to this point: Key One, and Key Two, plus the principle of Attrition, and also the Third Key, to learn that something wasn't true. We are taught that we often need to learn what isn't true before we can learn what is, and Joe applied the Third Key in a negative way to determine that he still hadn't found his answer yet. So, what did Joe do? I'm just laying out the groundwork for the answer. When we do a math problem, the teacher wants you to show your work, so I am showing my work. Corruption can occur at any step of the way (stepping up, or stepping down), but the final step in verifying whether an idea is a true principle, is actually trying to convert an idea into a true principle. The world of the soul is the world of principles. The job of the soul is to recognize truth and verify true principles. Even if an idea reaches this point in a currupted state, there will still be bits and pieces of the picture which are truth and which the soul can confirm. Then, with a confirmation of the true pieces, we can probably have enough knowledge to correct the remaining distorted or missing pieces of the puzzle/picture, giving us a true, complete picture. Or at least, as Bryan's quote said today, we get as much truth as we are able to handle at the time. This is what Joe did. He did something to see "how the word reverberated in the world of the Soul". So, what did he do? I think the word is related to "testing", "proving", or "verifying"? We often say that something "reverberates" or "resonates" or "rings true". It is no accident that all these terms have to do with sound. When tuning a guitar string, a musician needs to use judgment, but he also needs to apply that judgment to the idea of what a perfect "A" sounds like. So, he tunes and he tests, tunes some more and tests some more, until his judgment tells him that the string resonates with the "A" pitch. Some musicians have this idea in their minds. Others might compare it to a piano or tuning fork. Principles vibrate at the same frequency, so if bringing a new and as-yet, unprover idea together with proven principles causes the new idea (in your judgment) to resonate as a principle, or to vibrate in harmony, then it's a true principle. If not, then some adjustment is needed. Here are some other example of testing, trying, and proving. If somebody is considering buying a new car, he may kick the tires. This indicates to a person how much air pressure is in the tires, and to a person with judgment, they can thus tell if the tires are properly inflated. If somebody is checking out glassware, they will give a little thump on the side of the glass and listen to the sound. Crystal makes a distinctive sound or ring, which those with judgment can recognize. Plain glass makes more of an empty thud. So, I think the Key Word has something to do with testing. Another term for this kind of test is an experiment in truth, which experiment leads to experience. Suffience experience leads to understanding, and as we grow in the knowledge of a principle, we become an expression of that principle. The Bible says we are told to "try the spirits", "prove my words", and "prove all things and hold fast to that which is good". Trying or proving is the process you go through. Revelation (the word means to remove the veil from something) is the result of that process. Revelation to an individual restores the original principle, so my alternative choice would be "revelation". It all depends on how fine you want to break up this process. Each step has many sub-steps. Joe did not receive revelation that "receive" was not correct because the soul does not provide negative confirmation of false principles; it only provides positive confirmation of true principles. But, LACK of revelation to Joe was indeed vital information which he needed which which he interpreted, using his judgment as a negative confirmation. What Joe needs is a revelation of the true Third Key Word. He needs to come up with a better guess and repeat all the steps he went through the first time, see how it "reverberates in the world of the soul." For the story, my guess is John is going to leave without Joe guessing correctly. There will be another conversation with Wayne. Joe and Elizabeth will figure out the key word, and then they will wait "on pins and needles" (no pun intended) for John to return, so they can tell him their latest guess. In the meantime, Joe, better lock up that knife drawer! John "What we need is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite." - Russell, Bertrand, Sceptical Essays, p. 157. http://laluni.helloyou.ws/netnews/bk/intellect/inte1046.html "These men do not reason their way to conclusions, although reason - the search for truth - apparently played a part in preparation for their final insight. In every case, they experienced what, for want of a better term, we may call 'illumination'. We may, to be sure, brush these experiences aside as aberrations... but these men do not act after the manner of men suffering from an aberration. Out of them has come a great portion of the spiritual wisdom of the race. They are, as it were, among the illuminati of mankind. If 'by their fruits we shall know them,' these men have shown fruits so far above the average as to make them spiritual leaders of mankind." - Overstreet, H. A. The Enduring Quest, pages 238, 239, 240. "The mystic, cannot explain, but he knows that he has known and not merely felt, and often that knowledge remains an abiding possession which no criticism can touch... though the mystics seem to be unable to convey to others any body of truth which cannot be reached by more ordinary channels of experience and reasoning..." - Grensted, Rev. L.W., Psychology and God, pages 203-204. [151] In researching this, I ran across a great passage in DK talking about the phases of developing Soul Contact and dealing with true and false teachers, and Masters. I want to quote all of it, but here is the link: http://laluni.helloyou.ws/netnews/bk/hercules/herc1019.html "Aspirants need to remember that they become masters only by mastering" 46105 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 12:06:24 -0700 From: J J Dewey jjd@... Subject: Re: Re: Chapter 10/Immortal "Do you feel well enough to make us a hot beverage?" "I think so," she said. "How about some coffee?" "Sounds good," he said. "That would be a nice change. Where I've been lately they do not drink coffee." It would be a nice change if Joe made coffee or tea for John and Elizabeth, especially as Lizzie isnt feeling well and then she is sent out to the kitchen, and I was wondering why its always Elizabeth who has to make the tea and coffee in this series?.....is it because she is the woman or the wife, and why cant Joe sometimes make a cuppa for John and Elizabeth, or has he already? Hmmmmm... JJ My wife loves to take care of guests when they arrive. I do not even have to think about doing it myself because she always volunteers the service. Even so, our roles are not that traditional as I do almost all the grocery shopping and preparing meals. We both have our niches we have gravitated toward and neither feel taken advantage of. Thank God she does most of the housecleaning. John W writes: Joe heard the bells ringing, and thought it was John, but it turned out to be Philo. JJ Actually, the sound of the bells were from John sent as a warning. I'll have to add something to make this clear. Thanks to the group for your comments. They help me fine tune the writing. Copyright 2004 by J J Dewey 46106 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 22:29:53 -0000 From: "Johann Robert Arnarsson" johannarnars@... Subject: Re: Immortal 4 Chapter 10 Excelent breakdown John. John: I'm thinking about form-idea-principle triangle. An eternal word invokes a principle which expresses itself as an idea, which is the intelligent force which expresses itself as a form, and which maintains the existence of the form. There is a difference between the form and the things which make up the form. In the sending side of communication, I see a stepping down (those are supposed to be arrows going from the top down): | Principle | Idea v Form. On the receiving side, I see a stepping back up (arrows from the bottom up): ^ Principle | Idea | Form. Joe's steps were listen, hear, ???, understand. The "???" is the keyword which he unconsciously applied without knowing its name in order to reach the understanding that "receive" was not the key word. Combining the two (arrows from the bottom up): Understanding ^ Principle (Third Key Word) | Idea (listen) | Form (hear). Johann: This to me describes the connection beetween god and man. From the higher worlds the ideas travel to the world of form. And if we are going to keep that connection alive and not to fall from grace the connection must be kept in a pristine condition. What is this connection? It is god's love, it the good, it is the positive. In other words and to put it more simply, it is the restoration. I think this is the key word, the restoration of joy and the dominating good that has to be confirmed after a great toil and somtimes upheval. Walk firmly with god and you shall be blessed. The restoration of the wise. John: So, I think the Key Word has something to do with testing. Another term for this kind of test is an experiment in truth, which experiment leads to experience. Suffience experience leads to understanding, and as we grow in the knowledge of a principle, we become an expression of that principle. The Bible says we are told to "try the spirits", "prove my words", and "prove all things and hold fast to that which is good". Johann: Thy wisdom shall be tested comes to mind. John: But, LACK of revelation to Joe was indeed vital information which he needed which which he interpreted, using his judgment as a negative confirmation. Johann: No joy in that. So does the principle rest on judgement/wisdom, confirmation through becomming (experience) and the restoration of joy by being one with the father? At the risk of sounding like a zelot, anything otherwise is a sin? By the way I do make my own coffe :-) Yes, Joe stopped and was open to recive but he din't hit the right note, the note of truth, that's why truisims and eternal words are so important, and to have a good collection of them. Joe's steps were listen, hear, ???, understand. Lets's try this: Joe's steps were listen, hear, derrive a bad idea throug faulty judement that lead to no resonacne or confirmation that again lead to no understanding and therefore no restoration of joy. The photocopier and the DNA, correction, the method I use that I do a double take, when in doubt look again, the resolution of truth. Johann 46107 Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 18:31:26 -0600 From: "John Crane" JohnsBlog@... Subject: RE: Re: Immortal 4 Chapter 10 Johann: Joe's steps were listen, hear, ???, understand. Let's try this: Joe's steps were listen, hear, derive a bad idea through faulty judgment that lead to no resonance or confirmation that again lead to no understanding and therefore no restoration of joy. John: I disagree. Joe used good judgment. He rejected the word "receive" because he received no confirmation, and now he will continue his search. What am I saying? If he had used faulty judgment... Actually, there is no such thing as good and bad judgment. There is only judgment. You are either using it, or you are not. Remember what I said? The soul will not confirm a falsehood as being false. It will only confirm a truth as being true. Credit for this insight goes to Ani West of Denmark who wrote this up in a post several years ago. Her description of this principle was so good that JJ remarked that a Master of Wisdom could not have stated it better. Mine is a "corrupted" version of her statement, but since it was an eternal truth, you could still receive confirmation of it through the Soul. I learned the literal truth of this a couple of weeks ago. I was asking a question, but I seemed to be losing the Spirit in all aspects of my life. I was getting no confirmation of anything and no feeling of contact. Then, one day it dawned on me that I was asking the wrong question and should therefore, stop asking it. I received immediate confirmation of this truth, and the floodgates of truth opened in my mind for days upon days. John 46108 Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2004 01:44:08 -0000 From: "Johann Robert Arnarsson" johannarnars@... Subject: Re: Immortal 4 Chapter 10 John Crane wrote: I disagree. Joe used good judgment. He rejected the word "receive" Because he received no confirmation, and now he will continue his search. What am I saying? If he had used faulty judgment... Actually, there is no such Thing as good and bad judgment. There is only judgment. You are either using it, or you are not. Johann: This makes sense, there is only judgement. So the difference between good and bad judgement must therefore be wisdom. Thy wisdom shall be tested. What this means of course that now everything must be reworked and readjusted according to this. Thanks. Johann 46109 Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2004 04:17:12 -0000 From: "Dino H. Karountzos" DKarountzos@... Subject: re:Chapter10/ Book 4 Could the Key word be the principle of thinking, or the principle of right thought? Dino