2000 - WEEK 14 Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13582 From: Rick Audette Subject: Re: Dawning of the Age of Aquarius That was very interesting, reading about giving up coffee for lent. I just did a water fast from Friday to Sunday. I often go without eating on week ends, but this time I also excluded coffee. Ouch, Friday night and Saturday morning I had a headache and stiff neck. Not a good time for anyone to have engaged me in an ICQ chat ( sorry tinkerbell ). Things got much better after I went to the store and bought distilled water and some olive oil. The tap water here is hard to drink, and Caramel had suggested putting olive oil in the ears. The distilled water tasted so sweet, I'm going to have to keep some on hand all the time. The oil has helped a lot. I'm still not completely cleared, but I can now hear some on both sides and music sounds in tune again. Even before reading the coffee thing, I was thinking of not drinking any coffee for a while longer, to see what kind of benefits come of it. I'm thinking, if one is going to give up addictions to caffeine, nicotine, etc., it is best to drop one at a time, as doing everything at once can be a pretty big shock to handle. Rick -- ICQ # 19753992 visit my web pages at http://www.ont.com/users/rea1/ The only really natural diet http://www.neanderthin.com have you read "The Immortal" http://www.freeread.com *:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:* I'm only in it for the thrill Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13583 From: J J Dewey Subject: Dreams and Work Time to catch up on a few questions. Here is a question Glenys asked about the last chapter I posted. "Have the nine you've discussed in this chapter already become Masters? If so, would it be safe to assume they are part of the externalization of the Hierarchy? "If not, are they high initiates who will be attempting to achieve their fifth or higher initiations this lifetime. "Will they all be men?" Some Masters and initiates have incarnated to fill various rolls in bringing in the new age. Not all of them will be involved in what we call spiritual work, but all who are successful will be working for he benefit of mankind. As far as to whether or not the nine in prophesy will be masters will not be revealed for some time nor will it be revealed the extent to which the Masters will directly participate in the molecules to be created. Looking for Masters among our brethren tends to create a division and often an illusionary one. Therefore the true masters who will be doing their job will walk among us as equals and not seek for recognition of any status. As I have said before there are some fairly high initiates who have gotten side-tracked and caught up in illusion and will have to backtrack to get back to where they once were. This has caused some restructuring of plans, but there are certain high decisions that cannot be altered by anything we do. Will they all be men? Advanced initiates can choose their sex. Whether or not they will be men or women will depend on where the greatest opportunity for service exists. Trish, I am glad you discovered the problem with carbon monoxide. Sometimes physical distress comes from accidental situations and this must always be considered. And Rick, Glad you're feeling better. I just remembered that you have tried to quit smoking several times. If a person can go on a week fast when attempting to quit he will remove so many poisons out of his body that quitting smoking will be much easier. If a person has not fasted much he should start with several three day fasts first and always remember to break the fast with light food. James writes: Does anyone else feel we should get together in some kind of business venture or would it be better to find our own variety of self sufficient way to make a living??? JJ Eventually many of those who actively work to establish the kingdom of God will work together to make a living. The problem with this age is that we have to spend so much of our time just making a living that the only way that many of us can spend enough time together to create oneness in the soul is by working together for our livelihood. I have a business idea that can employ many of us but it would take some capital to create. This could be very big and give us tremendous power to gather the lights, but I do not want to publish the idea and give potential competitors the plan. I have also written some songs for the group. I have sent some of them to Mark Williams and he is working at arranging them. We'll shortly release them to the group and maybe others will inject their personalities into them. We'll sing a couple of them at the gathering in June. I know we have a number with musical talent in the group. We probably have enough potential to create a very good band. I have written other romantic type songs (words and music) that I believe have commercial value, but I do not play an instrument or have much native talent. If any of you are interested in taking a look at some of my tunes and doing some arranging let me know. Maybe we can get something going. Some time ago someone asked a question about what happens during sleep. The answer is quite interesting. There are two magnetic cords that connect the spirit to the body. One is linked to the heart and the other to the head. When you sleep the consciousness in the head departs and your thinking consciousness manifests on a higher plane. When we awake we generally have no memory of what we learned and experienced because the consciousness was away from the physical computer brain that records memory for waking consciousness. The connection to the heart, however, remains intact during sleep.. Now many new agers tell us to disregard the mind and live in the heart only. Actually this is what happens during sleep, so if we took their advice we would be in the normal sleeping state all the time. What causes dreams? It is generally the interplay of the heart with stored memories in the physical brain. The heart part of ourselves is missing the mind so the next best thing to compensate is the computer brain and the interplay between the two (heart and brain) produce dreams over which the mind has no control because it is not present. This is why the mind has difficulty in remembering dreams - it did not actually go through the dream experience but registers some of the memory upon returning when waking. Sometimes the mind or higher self will send impressions to cause us to have dreams of significance. When this happens you will wake up with a memory of the dream and a feeling that the dream is important and you should contemplate the meaning. What is the difference between sleep and death? In sleep only one of the major parts of yourself is absent. In death both the heart and the mind depart to the spiritual realms. Copyright 2000 By J.J. Dewey All Rights Reserved Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-01/13584 From: Deborah Matthies Subject: Brian/dark nite Editor's Note: Repeat post of No. 13572 Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-01/13585 From: Deborah Matthies Subject: Fwd: Brian/dark nite Editor's Note: Repeat post of No. 13572 Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13586 From: TheTripleGoddess Subject: Re: Dreams and Work Speaking of dreams, lately I've noticed that I have been dreaming a lot. I've been having very vivid dreams, astral projections, lucid dreams, and a few nightmares. I have had these all of my life, but now it seems like i'm having at least one of these a night. The other strange thing is that I have had insomnia for about 6 years, then all of a sudden a couple of weeks ago it disappeared. Completely out of the blue. I don't have any idea why. One day I would be awake till the wee hours of morning, the next I day I was sleeping like a baby. I guess that would be fine if the insomnia had been a short term thing, but after about 6 years of it I don't know what to think. I don't know if this is just temporary or what?! Anybody have any ideas? namaste!- Bonnie Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13587 From: "John Wayne Kline" Subject: RE: Re: Dreams and Work Well Bonnie, if I understand correctly what you said, a good possibility would be that the last six months were a time of more darkness than light, or decreasing light. Since Dec 22 the light has been increasing approximately one minute per day. The Pineal Gland reacts to light, and produces Melatonin. This Gland in truth is a step down transformer which converts higher frequencies into lower so they can be understood consciously at a lower level. The Pituitary Gland does just the opposite. It is a step up transformer. This could easily explain what is happening to you. Any increase of light to people who are depressed seems to help and I've noticed from personal experience that the more mystical ones nature, the more sensitive they are to light. The light seems to act as a trigger and catalyst. I often have people meditate with a bright Daylight balanced fluorescent light directly overhead and the results are unquestionable. Just a thought. Your Friend, John Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13588 From: xavier Subject: away for this week. hi all, i'll be away for the week, don't worry about me;-) I'm doing a therapy of past lives deaths traumas;-) (grin;-) c ya all. Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13589 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: Re: Dreams and Work: Bonnie Bonnie..to me these changes are obviously 'key' to your introduction to JJ's material and books..and your soul and higher self and in 'hoop-la' about it!!! So..your 'mystic-self' is having a holiday and has juiced up the lucid dreams, astral dimensional traveling, etc..and the 'peace' that your soul feels in finding 'real and viable' source for growth..maybe even for the first time...is letting you sleep like a baby! Love: Judes Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13590 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: Dreams and Work Loving greetings to One and All, I have been joining in with many different groups on the internet over recent weeks, lots of different chat rooms, and am astonished at the considerable number of minds that are awakening around the world. I felt last night so excited for meeting so many beautiful brilliant minds and incredibly loving hearts... that although they have come to where they are by various paths, we are able to see clearly the truth of oneness, of God-Consciousness, and the magnificent picture the internet weaves of our connectedness in consciousness. So many seem to have a clear understanding of non-duality, of no cause and effect, and have recognized these as concepts that one can go beyond, and enter into the oneness of who and what they are. Now I know this is not acceptable to all as yet, but when cause and effect become one... well where is cause and effect? The thought simply is manifesting outwardly... I had a wonderful experience of this earlier in the week. I was chatting to a very good friend in Australia, and she was going to lunch with a beautiful man... and in a very loving moment I simply wished her flowers and rainbows and delightful conversations... and then we signed off. The next moment my husband had come in with a beautiful posie of lavendar wild flowers, handing them to me... next I engaged in another conversation on the net and was laughing in delight in the conversation, looked up out my large windows, and there was a magnificent rainbow.... as I went ooohhh look at that... since my own words and thoughts were so fresh in my mind... I realized that in giving from a pure state of love to another... we do indeed also receive. And the time lapse is getting very short... time is indeed collapsing... and thus so too is cause/effect. Thought just IS. I personally have some trouble with those that observe and then 'describe' events, and then turn this description into a prescription for all future events... that is the creation of dogma to me. For me the goal is to become as unlimited as possible, not create more limitations in my mind. It is my humble consideration that we can be present here, but not identified with here, still identifying with our true identity.. and the oneness, God-consciousness that we are... totality... whatever words of identity we have given to that consciousness. So many are doing this and it is very uplifting to unite in consciousness with them. J J Dewey writes: "Some time ago someone asked a question about what happens during sleep. The answer is quite interesting." Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13591 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: Dreams and Work Loving greetings, Hi Bonnie, I would have to say for the past 6 years I too have been very awake and alert in consciousness, doing 'a lot' while supposedly sleeping at night. All of a sudden this changed in early January... and it was when I felt my teacher disconnect at the physical. I am no longer drawn physically whatsoever although feel still fully present with him in consciousness. That was the goal of the training... and so I finally went to sleep... and slept fairly deeply still dreaming of course... for about two months. Now there is once again quite intense consciousness activity, because on that level I am very in line with the school of my teacher although not physically present. I am glad to have slept for my body needed to rest and heal and I felt it was greatly rejuvenated during that sleeping period... So it is possible that you were doing many things in consciousness over the six years, just not remembering. We usually all go out of body every night.. although most do not remember... and I recall understanding that 'most' are helped out as I saw one night... and those helping them in spirit, were actually saying... okay here we go with the 'blind, deaf and dumb' and I realized that is often how we go out of body until we become awake and aware and fully conscious!! That caused great laughter in me!! Trust this is of assistance to you Bonnie... Humble servant of God, ZIA TheTripleGoddess writes: "Speaking of dreams, lately I've noticed that I have been dreaming a lot." Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13592 From: Maryellen Subject: Re: Lessons Continued I too had a similar experience in learning how to "let go." Seems we of great faith and positive influence have tried to use our power to "heal" or postpone the "moving forward" of a loved one without first considering what their soul's purpose really is. I did the same thing as you did Glenys with my father. It was his time to go and I just couldn't let him. I did everything in my power to help sustain his physical life. And so, and like you, he did live for another year! Another "dreadful" year. He was miserable physically and was forced to look at his "inadequacies" as he saw it. He identified so much with his physical strength and manliness, and now saw that fading rapidly. And so his mental and emotional states suffered too. All this, it seemed at my inability to let him move on. He even seemed to be 50% detached from this life too. He became distant and wanted to be alone. So I learned a very valuable lesson in this. I committed to never trying to force my will on someone who is ready to move forward again!!!! Now, of course this takes much discernment too. Like, I still think there is an appropriate place where our healing efforts are indeed needed and asked for. But when and if I am ever in the presence of someone who I discern to be wanting to be released from this physical life, I promise not to interfere. So I must add a special "Thank You Dad" to my father who offered to stick around an entire extra year to teach me this lesson. In Oneness, Maryellen Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13593 From: Maryellen Subject: Re: My Personal Crisis Trish "P. S. My family and I would greatly appreciate your prayers at this time. We are feeling a little better now that the problem has been solved but the amount of time that we were being poisoned has taken its toll and the symptoms have not all been alleviated." Trish, you have been blessed in finding the cause of your symptoms. And you are right about our own thinking. Most of us probably agree that we believe and try to recognize our physical ailments from a spiritual perspective. And........sometimes they are just purely physical. I have Fibromyalgia and still have not figured out the cause spiritual, physical or whatever, but I try, stay open and pray for clarity. I send you Trish and your dear family all my prayers and healing thoughts and energies for a full recovery. In Oneness, Maryellen Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13594 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: Lessons Continued Loving greetings to One and All, And welcome Maryellen, and thank you for sharing such a thoughtful post. Yes our loved ones do indeed teach us valuable lessons. And the most important lesson I saw in your words... 'is those that ask for our assistance in their healing'. Asking is vital. Giving without permission is really a violation of another's will. Yet also being able to hear the 'asking' is important. I salute you and welcome you... humble servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13595 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Lessons Continued Maryellen wrote: "....... I committed to never trying to force my will on someone who is ready to move forward again!!!! Now, of course this takes much discernment too. Like, I still think there is an appropriate place where our healing efforts are indeed needed and asked for." Thanks for sharing, Maryellen. It seems our loved ones left us both with important lessons. You are so right about the necessity of discernment. In my case, I did not struggle for my sister's life because I was afraid of her dying or losing her (although it was my preference that she didn't go) but because I genuinely believed she had more to do here. So what shook me more than anything was not hearing my soul correctly which was no doubt trying to tell me that it was time for her to move on. The other issue is that sometimes the personality of the dying one wants to live even though it is the will of their soul go. So even when a person asks for help to live, the work of a real healer who has soul contact may be to help them come to terms with their impending death knowing that it is in their best interests in terms of their evolution. In the end, that is what I did with my sister and she died within hours of my telling her it was OK to go and my describing the death process to her and helping her achieve peace. I had a similar experience with my mother. I knew it was her time to go and spent a year preparing her for it so that her death was hugely peaceful and almost saintly (at the risk of sounding corny). On the other hand, my brother had a heart attack soon after my mother's death - his heart actually stopped for a time and the hospital staff had problems reviving him - and I moved heaven and earth to keep him alive because I believed that it wasn't his time to go. He survived and while he still has health problems, he'll probably outlive us all :-) So I learnt that the work of a real healer is to discern with an attitude of divine indifference the true purpose of the person's soul and be impervious to the desires of the personalities of both the healer and one facing death. Not easy when you're emotionally attached to the person. Love Glenys -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Abundance is not something we acquire. It is something we tune into. ~ Wayne Dyer Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13596 From: "Deborah Matthies" Subject: Re: Dreams and Work Bonnie, I also have more vivid dreams, dreams with messages of encouragement. These have been more frequent beginning last june. And so much more the past three months. I also feel vibrations like at the start of an astral dream. What I find confusing is sometimes I am thrilled to go then other times i resist actually holding my pillow tightly. It kinda funny I can feel myself rising and then a quick drop as i tighten my gripe on my pillow, then i wake up after a few attempts to rise. I do as far as sleeping better, well I am more of a nite owl by nature so I don't sleep that much. I fight sleep until I'm ready to drop. much love, Deborah Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13597 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: My Personal Crisis "I have Fibromyalgia and still have not figured out the cause spiritual, physical or whatever, but I try, stay open and pray for clarity. In Oneness, Maryellen" Maryellen, I hope this is received in a spirit of love. I have a trusted source that is massage therapist. She massages more than one person with Fibromyalgia. She has looked into it extensively and claims that physical or emotional trauma, usually brought on by physical or emotional abuse of some kind, is usually the cause. It may go back to an abusive parent or an automobile accident, in which the trauma settled in the muscle tissues, and according to the one thus afflicted, has not been dealt with adequately. If parental abuse, the Fibromyalgia patient does well to confront the cause (which has usually been denied all of one's life). If a physical accident caused the trauma, then physical therapy can be helpful. If emotional abuse from a spouse, then psychological therapy may help. In any respect, my source insists that therapeutic massage is the best medicine, although it can be painful at first. And this must be accompanied by emotional therapy as well. Just relaying what my informant says. Love, Craig Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13598 From: Christopher Wynter Subject: Craig, Maryellen Re: My Personal Crisis Hello Craig ... (and Maryellen) What you write is correct. It is important here to remember also that there is a possibility that what might be uncovered is a memory of an inherited trauma .. All too often, therapists can point a finger at a trauma which we, the individual cannot accept as being our own. There is a term in Psychology "Repressed Memory Syndrome" and there has been a lot of damage caused by the lack of understanding (particularly of some professional therapists) of the nature of memory. I have done a lot of work on the nature of repressed and inherited memory, and this work is now finding support with some researchers, particularly in Australia, recognising that "Post Traumatic Stress Dissorder" can in fact, be inherited .. and that the symptoms are equal to those experienced "first hand" The way to deal with the release of this is not to label it, but to recognise and accept that it is a memory stored in the body .. whatever the source. This removes the onus of blame and allows a speedier "healing" However, it is important to recognise that the release can be very vivid .. because the same energy is coming out of the release as went into the original trauma .. whether the memory is this body or inherited. It is very important to breathe through the trauma because it was originally trapped by "catching" or stopping breathing .. at the moment it took place. This memory is imprinted into every cell of the body, but may only manifest in one region. I have had a number of verifiable cases where memory of (particularly sexual trauma) has been proved to have been experienced by parents and grandparents. Veterans Affairs in Australia is now officially accepting that the children are in fact, inheriting the trauma suffered by service men and women who served in Vietnam .. and this is the source of a number of identifyable behavioural and physical disorders Christopher Wynter Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13599 From: Maryellen Subject: Re: Dreams and Work JJ- I am enthralled with the idea of working together on this earth. Those of "light" getting together for the good of all. Just the idea of living among so many beings of light and love sends shivers throughout my body. Of course I have some friends who are of like mind, but I am not with very many often or at the same time. Oh, I glisten with the thought. You say you have an idea, and of course I want to know what it is, but you are right in keeping it unpublished for at least the time when you think you can come forth with it and present it to those of us who want to commit to working and "living" with each other. Sounds a little like a piece of heaven to me!!! I just joined this group and I already LOVE it. The comments I've read so far have been full of wisdom and heart. This almost feels like a "family of light!" OK OK, so I am excited. Just fyi, I had also subscribed to two other groups I thought I'd like also, but after seeing the "tons" of e-mail, I decided to unsubscribe to the other 2. I had read enough of the comments here to "know" that I must keep this one!! So, yea, I am loving it here. Feels so "right." With Love and Oneness to all, Maryellen Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13600 From: Maryellen Subject: Re: Lessons Continued Glenys writes: "So I learnt that the work of a real healer is to discern with an attitude of divine indifference the true purpose of the person's soul and be impervious to the desires of the personalities of both the healer and one facing death. Not easy when you're emotionally attached to the person." You are absolutely correct in your thinking here. That is exactly what I was trying to say too. But, like you say, it is not easy when it is someone you are very attached to, but we must keep ourselves aware of this in any attempts to intervene. All we can really do is give them LOVE and be ever so tuned in to our own Divine Guidance as to discern what is the best and highest for all. And thank you, dear ones for your warm welcome. I love it here and feel very "comfy" with all of you already!! Love and Oneness, Maryellen Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13601 From: Diane Linen Subject: Re: My Personal Crisis I can definitely attest to this, Craig. Physical trauma due to a car wreck caused extensive injuries for me and the body will try to protect from further injuries by sort of 'hugging' the injured area. Just one case in point with me was the back of my right calf. I couldn't walk very far without pain in the calf. I have been in casts four times with that leg and had a leg brace that I wore for 3 years. The fascia had tightened around the calf muscles to the point where movement and circulation was severely restricted causing pain. I had a long series of deep tissue massage that freed the fascia and the muscles to the point where walking was no longer so painful. Diane Craig Tholson wrote: "I have Fibromyalgia and still have not figured out the cause spiritual, physical or whatever, but I try, stay open and pray for clarity. In Oneness, Maryellen" "Maryellen, "I hope this is received in a spirit of love. "I have a trusted source that is massage therapist. She massages more than one person with Fibromyalgia. She has looked into it extensively and claims that physical or emotional trauma, usually brought on by physical or emotional abuse of some kind, is usually the cause. It may go back to an abusive parent or an automobile accident, in which the trauma settled in the muscle tissues, and according to the one thus afflicted, has not been dealt with adequately. If parental abuse, the Fibromyalgia patient does well to confront the cause (which has usually been denied all of one's life). If a physical accident caused the trauma, then physical therapy can be helpful. If emotional abuse from a spouse, then psychological therapy may help. "In any respect, my source insists that therapeutic massage is the best medicine, although it can be painful at first. And this must be accompanied by emotional therapy as well. "Just relaying what my informant says. Love, Craig" Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13602 From: Rick Audette Subject: The adventure continues Hi All, I'm slowly recovering my hearing. I should be stressed more than ever, this week, because I have to go to court next monday, but instead find myself in a better mood than usual. Part of that I attribute to the fact that I trust, have faith, that things will work out and knowing that, I won't allow myself to worry about it. Besides, for as much as I've paid to lawyers, I can't have much karma left over :) The other thing that's really got me stirred is doing work on the Petra comic. I just got all the text added to the first chapter and invite your reviews. Check it out at, http://members.xoom.com/petracity/chap_01.htm I'm having loads of fun doing this project. I don't know, I can only spend so much time talking about philosophy, before I just have to get out and get busy. It's a hoot and it just keeps inspiring me do more. I know, it's only a comic book, but I feel it has a magical potential to do some good. By the time I finished writing, tonight, I was very thirsty, in more ways than one. See if it effects you in the same way. Would you click, to go and read chapter two? Rick -- ICQ # 19753992 visit my web pages at http://www.ont.com/users/rea1/ The only really natural diet http://www.neanderthin.com have you read "The Immortal" http://www.freeread.com *:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:* I'm only in it for the thrill Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13603 From: Christopher Wynter Subject: [Diane] Re: My Personal Crisis Diane From your description, I would feel there could possibly be holding patterns from the symptoms you describe in the Left Hip and the right shoulder .. The left ankle will also be holding the pattern from trying to do the work of both ankles ... also, there could be a referred twist in the sacrum which will reflect into the occiput (at the back of the skull) which may show up as headache symptoms in this area .. particularly in doing this work. Often, all that is necessary is to ask your body what areas are affected, and use your breath into that area over a period of a week or so to allow the soft tissue to restore itself. It is reflexed injury to other parts of the body which causes deportment changes and gait changes .. and these perpetuate a constant unconscious reminder of the original trauma Christopher Wynter Diane wrote: "I can definitely attest to this, Craig. Physical trauma due to a car wreck caused extensive injuries for me and the body will try to protect from further injuries by sort of 'hugging' the injured area. Just one case in point with me was the back of my right calf. I couldn't walk very far without pain in the calf. I have been in casts four times with that leg and had a leg brace that I wore for 3 years. The fascia had tightened around the calf muscles to the point where movement and circulation was severely restricted causing pain. I had a long series of deep tissue massage that freed the fascia and the muscles to the point where walking was no longer so painful." Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13604 From: TheTripleGoddess Subject: Re: Re: Re: dreams and work john, judes, and deborah, you all make valid points. thanks for sharing them with me! :-) also, i had these two strange nightmares that seem related in a round-about way. both of them featured this huge native american guy. in the first one he saved me from falling down this stairway to nowhere. and i was extremely greatful for his help in the dream. in the second nightmare though, this big native american guy, i'm not sure if he was same one as before or not, but he looked pretty much the same, he shapechanged from a wolf to the native american form and was trying to kill my sister, brother, and i. the weird thing is that he was not alone. there were 4 wolves and one of them was my sister, and the other two were native american women. but, it was only the guy trying to kill us. and i managed to get away, but i knew i had to go back and try to save the others. then, i woke up. i don't know where i came up with this native american guy. or the girls for that matter. and if it was the same guy, why would he be hero in one dream and a violent killer in the next? makes me wonder. i love to analyse dreams and try to find meanings. i've noticed though that lately my dreams are getting harder and harder to analyse on my own. i dunno, i just find it all interesting. namaste! bonnie Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13605 From: Rick Audette Subject: Re: Lessons Continued "Some people believe that healing by faith is all psychological. Is there such a thing as true healings by faith? If so what is the principle behind it? How can we harness this power so such healings are more available to us?" Ok, I confess, I really think faith healing is real, and only was trying to stir the pot with the things I said. I've even done a bit of it myself, here and there. I usually surprise myself when I find what I can do and then lay off playing with it. One time, I gave some girl a massage, without even touching her. The lights were dim and I could not see well, so I was sort of "not seeing" in the way JJ described and could make out her etheric aura quite well. It was shades of electric blue and I would bring my fingers near the darker colored spots and sparks would jump across and bring relief to the sore areas. I don't think it was psychological, in that case, because neither of us thought I was any kind of healer. When Rachel was little, we adopted a stray puppy. I'm not big on keeping animals in the house, but the girls loved it so I put up with it. It was kind of sickly, so I was checking up on it while the girls were out and it started shaking and just keeled over dead, it's heart and breathing both stopped. I put my hands on it and commanded it to live and it started breathing and it's heart started beating again. Cool, I had the power to restore life. It seemed good as new for a while, but then convulsed and died again. Well, if I could do it once, I could do it again and did. I brought that puppy back to life three times, but when it died the fourth time, I reasoned that maybe it was meant to be, so I let him go. There's a time for everything, even death. I think one thing we could all do to increase our healing powers is to just know, have faith, that we indeed do have the power. Christ healed the sick and raised the dead and many other things. I take it that He knows a lot more about these things than I do and if He says we will do what He did, and more, I'll accept that, when the time comes for me to work miracles, nobody will have to give me that power. I'll just do it and it will work, because I have faith, based on having already conducted a number of scientific experiments. Rick -- ICQ # 19753992 visit my web pages at http://www.ont.com/users/rea1/ The only really natural diet http://www.neanderthin.com have you read "The Immortal" http://www.freeread.com *:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:* I'm only in it for the thrill Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13606 From: Fiona Subject: I Remember (The defilement of the sacred) I Remember ... the sacredness of myself in the face of the profanity of spiritual imagery I remember as a child looking through the bodies of people around me and not understanding why they were full of black, grey, red ... no life force As a child I remember the words of my teachers used as weapons... It wasn't just the words they used ... it was the energy behind the words. Anger, resentment, hopelessness, fear, and sometimes sarcastic humour ... which seemed to be at my expense. Words used as weapons by adults to assault the bodies of the children in their care. The innocent I child learned to not speak out, not express for fear of their response. The God outside was a wrathful God. If I misbehaved ...there would be consequences with the threat of the fires of hell burning in the background ... let alone Mother's reaction!! Anything sacred or special was revered outside the body. Worshipped outside ...the ultimate indignity of worshipping an icon, usually with a frozen face or lifeless statue. The child learned that sacred was foreign to the body that the opposite existed in the body. A child born separate from God can never be sacred or special. The child learned to survive by taking on the projections of the opposite from those who called themselves sacred or holy ... projections of evil, unworthy, invisible, hopeless ... life force made wrong Withdrawn .. silence became the only safe place. Silence and the trees because they didn't question who the innocent was. Their branches opened wide to embrace me. Whatever I have held onto in my life ... relationships, friendships, jobs, were all taken from me. Whatever I have held onto as a special memory blocked me from living in the moment ... until the weight of the Past collapsed in on my Present and left me paralysed literally. My legs stopped working, went numb and I had no sensation or feeling from my waist down to my toes. I couldn't move forward and the Past was suffocating my life force. I was split in two. In trying so desperately to create the life projected onto me by parents, peers ... I split myself in two. Left and right side of the body no longer co-ordinated or communicating together. Left brain kept screaming, duty, expectations, obligations, survival at all costs ... and was firmly locked into past ways of coping. Right brain went silent ... savage migraines, nightmares and waking up in cold sweats its only communication. And in the middle ...nothing. Nothing but a yawning chasm ... Death seemed like a welcome option. My body had rejected me and the lie I was living ... the dreamless sleep of death beckoned ... The smallest function seemed too much. I felt like I was "losing it" and going crazy. All my hopes and dreams became my nightmares and the fear was very, very, real ... I had created the opposite of my dream by holding on so tight I strangled myself. I stopped the blood flow to my legs because I no longer had the will to move forward. Everything I thought I'd be or do in my life dissolved. I have been stopped in this way more than once ... The battle between what I knew as sacred and what I was shown, what I was taught to believe .. which was the opposite of what I knew ....was huge. Underneath "learned" sacred? Because of my body beliefs of lack, of unworthiness, of the fear of remembering who I really am ... is self judgment and emptiness. Judgment and regret that the experience of my knowing was only a moment and not maintained ... that in my life I had glimpses of the light that I am ... but not maintained it in the face of what I had to learn for my survival as a child ... My own self judgment that I am unable to live in the moment because the tendrils of this past and its fear of future consequence weave their constant web ... My own self judgment that I've seen it in others and projected my lack onto them and made them into something they were not because I couldn't or wouldn't see myself ... because I was lost in my judgment and fear. Fear of death and facing the fear of my own self judgments and regrets ... Fear of once more not accepting the gift of who I am because my body remembers how what was once inherently sacred, my self, my integrity was made profane ... Yet .. now my mind has found out that sacred is not "outside" .. it is inside .. it is me .. my essence .. not sacred, but the truth of my existence under what others tried to teach me to believe .. The sacred is My body, My innocence and I. .. and with an act of will, I will allow my body to release projections on it ... and to remember it is not profane. Fiona Tulk Hobart Tasmania Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13607 From: Diane Linen Subject: Re: [Diane] Re: My Personal Crisis Chris, From the damage done to my body in the car wreck and then being run over by my own car you've picked about the only two places that are actually doing fine; the left hip and right shoulder. The right hip I've had problems with and the left shoulder from the run over thingie; almost lost my left arm in that one. God has saved me something, I just need to find out what. ;) Diane Christopher Wynter wrote: "Diane From your description, I would feel there could possibly be holding patterns from the symptoms you describe in the Left Hip and the right shoulder" .. Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13608 From: J J Dewey Subject: To Heal By Faith The question: "Some people believe that healing by faith is all psychological. Is there such a thing as true healings by faith? If so what is the principle behind it? How can we harness this power so such healings are more available to us?" Rick - I'm glad to see that you really do believe in the power of faith after all. And when I say faith I mean to use the word as it was used in ancient times. Perhaps it would be helpful to the group if I relate my first experience with the power of faith. As a young teenager I became active in the Mormon Church. About the age of sixteen I figured it was about time to learn what the church really believed so I read the Book of Mormon. What impressed me most about the book was the comparison of the faith and experiences of the people in the book to the current LDS church. Miracles and the exercise of faith seemed to be a common thing in both the Book of Mormon and the Bible yet I did not see anything like those ancient works in the current church. After I finished the book I had a sense that the faith in the churches today was weak and this was not supposed to be the case - that miracles are just as possible today as they were in ancient times. I was thinking along these lines one day when I was walking home from school and as I walked by the home of a classmate I noticed her in her yard hobbling about on crutches. She had recently been struck with Multiple Sclerosis and was quickly deteriorating. I stopped and watched her for a moment and my heart went out to her as I thought about how healthy and vibrant she was just a short time ago, but now she seemed to be doomed to a short and painful life. As I looked at her from a distance (she didn't seem to notice my gaze) a thought occurred to me. Why couldn't I just stretch forth my hand and command her to be healed just like one of the ancient prophets? Do not the scriptures tell us that whatever we ask in faith in the name of Jesus Christ shall be done? What was there to prevent me from doing this right now, I thought to myself? As I asked myself these questions another thought came into my mind, almost like an answer given from some unseen source. It went something like this. "Hold on there! Who do you think you are? If there are any miracles to be had they must be done through the authority of the Church and only with the Melchizedek Priesthood. You do not have this priesthood yet and therefore you have no authority to heal." After this impression came to me with great force I began to doubt myself and just about walked on, but then my mind reflected back to the scriptures and I thought of several miracles where the disciple merely healed by faith in Christ with no mention of any priesthood or church position. Then these words came into my mind: "Whatsoever you ask in the name of Christ shall be done." I again looked in the direction of my friend with the intention of healing her by faith, but again the doubt came: "You have no authority to heal. You would displease God to even attempt it." Then after a moment of doubt the other voice came: "Whatsoever you ask in the name of Christ shall be done." These two thoughts bounced back and forth in my consciousness for what seemed to be an eternity, but I knew it was only a short moment. After this point of tension I realized that my choice was between the church and the scriptures so I decided to rely on the word of the scriptures. I realized that the promise of the scriptures was predicated on faith and not position. After making a definite decision to proceed I stretched forth my right hand and looked at her in the distance and whispered: "I command you in the name of Jesus Christ to be healed!" Immediately after finishing this sentence I felt a tremendous power surging through my body. It was so powerful it made me weak and I almost fell to the ground. My first thought was that maybe I was wrong to heal contrary to church guidelines and that perhaps God was going to strike me with his wrath. I ran home and laid down a few moments and collected myself. It wasn't long before I seemed to return to normal but I felt that perhaps I should think twice before being so brazen as to attempt a miracle again without the blessing of the church. I pretty much put the incident out of my mind until two days later at school I noticed that my classmate was attending again and seemed to be walking and playing like any normal teenager. I approached her and asked her about her recovery. She said she seemed to be fine now and her doctor told her that she was experiencing a remission, but there was no guarantee it would last. At this point I realized that the power of God I felt flow through me was not God striking me, but that this was some type of healing power that passed through me into her. I sensed that she was having more than a remission, but she was actually healed from a so-called incurable disease. I kept an eye on her all through high school and noticed that her health seemed fine until graduation after which I never saw her for about 35 years. Then after all this time came a day when my wife and I were having breakfast in a local restaurant. As we were talking a lady approached our table and said to me: "You're Joe Dewey, aren't you?" "Yes," I said. "And you would be?" I did not even recognize her until she introduced herself as my old classmate. After we talked a while I asked her if her MS ever came back and she told me that it never did. In fact she told me she outlived her husband who had died a few years back. After she went back to her table my wife asked me if that was the lady that I had told her about. I told he that it was. She said - You mean you never told her the real reason she was healed. I told her that I didn't see any reason to. This incident does answer one important question that some have asked. Does the one who is to be healed need to be aware of the healing process to be healed? Obviously the answer is no. Since this occurrence I have had many other realizations in connection with healing, but that will have to wait for the next installment as I am out of time and that will have to be the next installment. Copyright 2000 By J.J. Dewey All Rights Reserved Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13609 From: Marylin Subject: Re: The adventure continues Hi Rick I am having a terrible time pulling up the first chapter. I tried yesterday and got a "time out". I am doing this from AOL, if that has anything to do with it. I tried again today, 4 times, with the htm ending and just in case an html ending. Would you believe that a "win the freelotto" page came up with html. LOL I've check my typing over and over and have put in the correct address as you gave it. So how do I get to read comics? Love, Light, Peace and Harmony Marylin Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13610 From: Marylin Subject: Re: To Heal By Faith JJ writes: "This incident does answer one important question that some have asked. Does the one who is to be healed need to be aware of the healing process to be healed? Obviously the answer is no." Hi JJ and all This is a wonderful and amazing experience you had. It makes me look back at the questions I had when I was young. I just wasn't brought up in the Mormon Church so was not hindered by the type of "control" they seem to maintain now.I also have a couple of questions here. I realized that it is not necessary for another to know that they are being healed, but what if the healing prayed for is not in their life contract? I know we can change much, but wouldn't this be not possible if the person being healed hadn't intended (in the beginning) to be healed? These are points that have bothered me for some years now. I used to pray for my oldest son and every time I did, things went haywire for him. I did the praying without his knowledge. I finally stopped for a while and now, when I do, I always ask our Father with "if it is according to Your Will". Since he lives many miles away from me now, I have no way of knowing what is happening to him. He's not at all communicative.I used to dream about having the "power to heal". Still do. Love, Light, Peace and Harmony Marylin Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13611 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: The adventure continues Nice Rick; can I book a flight to the New City? And, is Petra married??? Love, Craig "Rick Audette" writes: "http://members.xoom.com/petracity/chap_01.htm" Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13612 From: TheTripleGoddess Subject: Re: Re: to heal by faith: Marilyn Marilyn, That has often been a thought of mine. What if that person isn't supposed to get well, or doesn't want to. As a reiki practitioner, I was taught to usually ask the person ahead of time if they would like to receive healing energy. Sometimes, though, it can be awkward butting in on people's affairs. Sometimes we think a person could really use some help with healing, but don't know how to bring up the subject or even approach the person. When I find myself in this situation I end up leaving it up to God's will and the will of the individual. The reiki masters who taught and initiated me covered this subject. They told me that in that kind of situation you can send a healing with a message. Like: "this healing is for you to take or reject concerning your highest good." This way it is more of a soul-to-soul message. You can then leave it up to God and the ill person's soul and life plans. Their highest good being what is best for their experience here on earth and when to move on to the next level. I hope this helps some. Namaste! Bonnie Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13613 From: "Stardancer" Subject: To Heal By Faith Hi Marilyn: This is great stuff! One of the keys that I have come across as a healer in my work has just been touched upon. The power is there and everywhere and it is our job to be vessels that allow it to flow. I was taught in many of my classes when in school that chakras should look a certain way and needed to be fixed to look that way. When I began to practice what I was taught, the veil would open and an angel would come through and stand by the table and shake her head at me. No words, just shake her head. I learned very quickly that I was not there to fix anything but to facilitate the energy and support whatever energy needed to be supported for the individual to experience whatever they need for their healing. "Not my will, but thy will." There are 3 principles,among many others, that I have learned that were taught within the concept of manifesting and self acualization that I would like to share. 1. Be independent of the good opinion of others. 2. Have no attachment to the outcome. 3. No investment in power over others. As I apply these aspects of living in my therapy I am able to stay very clear and detached in relation to the healing process or immediate miracle or both as they show up in peoples lives. I see the perfection in everything: health, disease, cleansing, life and death. Moving into a space of living in eternity instead of time helps tremendously. With Much Love and Healing Ray Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13614 From: Maryellen Subject: Re: Dreams and Work Zia writes: "Now I know this is not acceptable to all as yet, but when cause and effect become one... well where is cause and effect? The thought simply is manifesting outwardly..." I agree that time is collapsing and that there is much less time between cause and effect or "karma". But even if the time gets so short that there is only thought and instant manifestation, isn't that still cause and effect? There can be no manifestation without the idea first, right?? Just wondering if I got the concept you are trying to explain correctly!! Blessings, Maryellen Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13615 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: To Heal By Faith Loving greetings to One and All, J J Dewey: This incident does answer one important question that some have asked. Does the one who is to be healed need to be aware of the healing process to be healed? Obviously the answer is no. Zia: It occurs to me that you have said here JJ 'one who is to be healed need to be aware of the healing' and that aware of a healing and asking permission are two different things. As I child we are very connected to our soul/spirit/God, and for me there is an understanding of when a healing is desired and this is known in the simplicity of the child. Another child would naturally desire life and health, and this is known, perhaps unspoken but known, and is what I meant by being able to 'hear another's request' for healing. As I see it, free will operates on all levels of consciousness, and a healing can easily be rejected if a person has chosen to move on through passing. As I see it asking for the 'highest Good of All to be done' takes care of it all!! Only that which is for the highest good will occur!! Does the person need to be aware of the healing process... no. Even in our healing attention to many on the list, the healings are occurring, is it one's self, is it because of certain others and their love, or all on the list... or a combination... or one specific person... what would it matter... for we are all ONE, and by that grace receive through the oneness of who and what we are. Ego is such an entrapment in the healing of others. Stepping out of the way, and being so beautifully tested JJ and shown the results and not needing any acknowledgement or glorification are certainly the highest ideals being demonstrated in my humble opinion. And also the insurance that these abilities in healing... which by the way truly have nothing to with the 'us'... we simply are the vehicle to the powerful energies of Christ to pass through that others might be healed... these abilities will continue to manifest and grow and opportunities multiply for there are so many in need of healing at this time, and willing to receive. When we simply love another... are they aware of this... often times not... and love is the power that allows the healing. All the healing in the world will have no effect without love. So in simply loving with full attention upon the one in front of you, can be such a profound healing. Did they ask for it? Are they aware of it? Perhaps not, yet we all desire to be loved, and that love creates such a bond of understanding... that it is remarkable. Just an aside JJ, I have been reading different web sites on Padre Pio, striving to understand the 'purpose' of one carrying the stigmata. This was never fully answered on the list in the time of Sterling and all its discord. I am interested to know how you view one carrying the stigmata and its purpose. I had come to understand that what actually kept the Catholic Church alive for 2000 years was simply the fact that the priesthood carried the ability to imbue the bread and wine with the body and blood of Christ. Without that ability I am certain the church would have fallen. Last night I found this quote by Padre Pio on the one of the sites:'Always remain close to the Catholic Church, because it alone can give you true peace, since it alone possesses Jesus in the blessed Sacrament, the true prince of peace.' What I came to understand in myself over the last few weeks of allowing this energy to be present with me, is the significance of the body and blood of Christ and this ceremony. For me I now understand that to eat of the body of Christ... the bread imbued with his body/spirit energy is to take in the 'incorruptible body of Christ'... immortality... and to partake of the wine, being imbued with the body/spirit energy of Christ is the DNA 'replacement' so to speak providing the correct coding to maintain an immortal body. Thus radiant health and vitality being the result, youth and longevity etc. Your comments if you have the time would be appreciated. This one ceremony I see as having kept the CAtholic Church alive through its darkest hours, since it brought the living Christ into presence. I am curious if the Mormon church also had this ceremony? I would say simply to be 'allowing' of Christ energies to flow through us at all times, allows healings in whatever endeavor and event we may be involved with, and that laying the picture of perfection upon another is to see truly the face of Christ upon all... and thus the healing is a natural outcome. Allowing that, rather than seeing one as the instigator of it... was the lesson I gained from your sharing JJ. You the child, profoundly acknowledged that healing energy flowing through you to another. That is indeed beautiful. And also since no one else saw... you were not confronted with the fears, opinions, recognition etc of others and allowed to accept and grow in your gained understanding. I cringe at the thought of 'miracles' appearing with witnesses, since the 'effects' on those witnesses is outside control, reason and often sanity!! The thought laid upon our world of its healing including everyone on it, is such a glorious picture... the new heaven... and NEW EARTH... imagine that... health longevity youth beauty... effortlessly (yes forget that gym!!) and able to follow one's hearts and dreams in personal evolution.... ahhh the adventure has just begun! Humble servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13616 From: Maryellen Subject: Re: Craig, Maryellen Re: My Personal Crisis Thank you Craig and Chris... Yes, you are both correct of these possible causes. I have heard about a trauma settling and causing pain. The problem is, doesn't "everyone" have traumas in their life?? I was not ever sexually abused, nor physically beaten- but in the emotional arena, of course I have had a lot of trauma. But most people I know can talk about their individual traumas but have not seemed to manifest the FMS pain. I have taken lots of looks back in time to try and discover what may have happened at the particular time. One pretty clear thing is that I had my second child in March of 90 and also had another cosmetic type surgery in Aug. The pain began in about Oct. Started in one elbow and has since moved to include practically every square inch of my body! It is pretty amazing. So, Ok, a C-Section is a surgery, but lots of people have them. My marriage was falling apart too, but that is not rare either. I've looked at my childhood pretty extensively and def. have a lot there that still makes me angry and hurt about my parents, sister and even a kind of perverted teacher. But I believe I have done work to release these "pains." I truly thank you for your efforts in trying to help me. Blessings, Maryellen Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13617 From: Christopher Wynter Subject: [Maryellen] Re: Dreams and Work Zia writes: "Now I know this is not acceptable to all as yet, but when cause and effect become one... well where is cause and effect? The thought simply is manifesting outwardly..." Maryellen writes: "I agree that time is collapsing and that there is much less time between cause and effect or "karma". But even if the time gets so short that there is only thought and instant manifestation, isn't that still cause and effect? "There can be no manifestation without the idea first, right?? Just wondering if I got the concept you are trying to explain correctly!!" Karma collapses when consciousness transcends the time/space continuum .. and this can be experienced by becoming one with the breath .. Karma exists when doing is conditional on a consciously or unconsciously expected outcome ... and its (karma's) effective energy is a mirror of the need, expectation or condition behind the doing .... Transcendence occurs when there is no attachment or expectation of outcome and action follows "being" (the breath) because the inbreath and the outbreath cancel each other out fully. When there is a need or expectation, there is an interruption to the natural flow of the breath Christopher Wynter Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13618 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: To Heal By Faith Loving Greetings to One and All, Marylin writes: "JJ writes: "This incident does answer one important question that some have asked. Does the one who is to be healed need to be aware of the healing process to be healed? Obviously the answer is no." "Hi JJ and all This is a wonderful and amazing experience you had. It makes me look back at the questions I had when I was young. I just wasn't brought up in the Mormon Church so was not hindered by the type of "control" they seem to maintain now. I also have a couple of questions here. I realized that it is not necessary for another to know that they are being healed, but what if the healing prayed for is not in their life contract? I know we can change much, but wouldn't this be not possible if the person being healed hadn't intended (in the beginning) to be healed?" Hi Marilyn, Just love your questions... and for me the answer is to remember who and what I am... and in that understanding accept that eternal LIFE, is what I am... that LIFE is the goal and its ongoingness. To me in reaffirming LIFE in any situation, is the highest ideal and goal. Would it then be wrong to through that LOVE OF LIFE see this simply for another, offering a different choice and the opportunity to go beyond... past limitations and beliefs that we must die to honor a contract??? These contracts... past patterns playing out... all of that is changeable in a moment... for the goal is LIFE, LOVE, and the pursuit of happiness for each one of us. Completing with that past, being set free with a clean slate... is that not what Christ did for so many... ??? And is that not what Christ will do flowing through an 'allowing' vehicle?? That the Cross of pain and suffering and the belief in death and dying... all of this can be discarded... so that LIFE ANEW free of that paradigm, is offered to ALL?? That to me is the eventuality of the new heaven and NEW EARTH... wow no fear of pain and suffering... no beliefs in aging and dying... hmmm I could do a lot of dreaming here.... Love to you Marilyn... and All Humble servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13619 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: Dreams and Work Loving greetings to One and All, Hi Maryellen, Oneness to me means exactly that... we keep separating things into duality... that gives us the definition of time... the cause and then the effect. Yet when I remember the oneness that I am...there is no separation the thought is NOT separate to its pictured reality... God- consciousness is in it all... the more we accept that... funnily enough the more it becomes our reality... and we move into a oneness in ALL THINGS... God-consciousness is not separate from creation, it is flowing through all of creation it is the LIFE of all creation. For me it is a choice of identity... oneness, seeing myself in reflection of the consciousness I am... it changes everything.. well actually the change is to let go the 'illusion' that there is some separateness. In many ways it is not thinking with heart or mind, but the Consciousness of who and what you are... in that oneness... What is so brilliant to me is we can 'think' any way we want, see any way we want... and in this moment what is the separation between who and what I am... to what??? Did Jesus identify with Jesus or did he identify so totally with the Christ... no separation... Humble servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13620 From: J J Dewey Subject: Appreciating the Rainbow Zia writes: Now I know this is not acceptable to all as yet, but when cause and effect become one... well where is cause and effect? The thought simply is manifesting outwardly... Maryellen comments: I agree that time is collapsing and that there is much less time between cause and effect or "karma". But even if the time gets so short that there is only thought and instant manifestation, isn't that still cause and effect? There can be no manifestation without the idea first, right?? Just wondering if I got the concept you are trying to explain correctly!! JJ Your thinking is sound here Maryellen. Without cause and effect what do we have? Nothingness. Not much to get excited about or look forward to. In almost every post Zia tells us of something that brings joy into her life and the interesting thing is that all these things are related to cause and effect. I've never heard anyone on or off this list ever tell me something like this: "I've had a great time today in the void of nothingness." In fact such a statement would be an oxymoron because there is no time or consciousness in the void. In her last post on this subject Zia mentions that: (1) Had a great time in chat rooms (2) Enjoys her dream state (3) Saw a magnificent rainbow These are all enjoyments from cause and effect. I would say this. That if all of Zia's enjoyments, as well as the rest of us, come from cause and effect that we are much too identified with duality to even consider any immediate departure. Any release from cause and effect is pure theory that has never been demonstrated much less explained in any reasonable way. If it were possible to escape cause and effect for even a moment you would disappear body mind and soul from this reality and the world would be as if you had never existed. I'm not sure about the rest of you but this path has no interest for me. I suggest that we keep in touch with the reality of cause and effect to the extent that we can at least appreciate Zia's rainbow. Copyright 2000 By J.J. Dewey All Rights Reserved Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13621 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: [Maryellen] Re: Dreams and Work Loving greetings to One and All, Thank you Christopher for your wonderful words that fill in for what I know to be true... astonishingly we can so easily live in that transcendent state right here!! Humble servant of God, ZIA From: Christopher Wynter Karma collapses when consciousness transcends the time/space continuum .. and this can be experienced by becoming one with the breath .. Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13622 From: Maryellen Subject: Re: To Heal By Faith Dear Zia, You have a beautiful way of expressing yourself. Your words are so full of clarity, love, humbleness and wisdom. Well, as I sit here, (new in this group) reading all the healing messages, it occurs to me to ask all of you, if you would, PLEASE send me your healing energies for this fibro pain. As I said, I have tried many many types of healings and therapies, so I would love to feel all of your energies. I am open and receptive to healing and will accept perfect health!! Thanks so much to all and May Your Light Shine Ever Brighter. Love, Maryellen Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-03/13623 From: Diane Linen Subject: Re: Dreams and Work * Zia wrote: "What is so brilliant to me is we can 'think' any way we want, see any way we want... and in this moment what is the separation between who and what I am... to what??? Did Jesus identify with Jesus or did he identify so totally with the Christ... no separation..." Exactly! We are what and how we think. It's so simple; not easy but simple. Thanks for pointing this out Zia. Diane Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13624 From: Miciella Subject: Re: To Heal By Faith I love how all this is coming together..... Each one I read is putting it into a whole.....for a deeper understanding of the Path we have walked...... And the Path ahead If I may share some of what I experienced on this subject..... Back in 90" I was taking some healing classes from the Berkeley Psychic IST. and one night I was standing over this man sitting in a chair in front of me......My hands raised high forming a cone shape calling in for his Highest Healing.... Well, all of a sudden this guy starts jerking and his body went into contortions of all kinds....... Well, as my eyes are getting very big and my thought's are What the _ _ _ _ is going on???? My teacher says strongly to me "DON'T MOVE!!!" Ok ... No Problemo..... !!!! Any thing you say...!!! This guy is still in this state of something close to looking like an epileptic fit..... I forgot what the teacher had me do then or if we just let it subside..... but he became calmer..... And the Teacher said to me ..... You did that.... You brought that healing energy in from a memory of your of my past life's...... (In the next weeks class his wife told me it steed with him and really did scare him....... she had to do work on him at home) The point here is, in being that vessel to direct the healing....Is a huge responsibility..... And another BIG lesson in that........ came in 92' I was in this Group and we put on the event in Mt. Shasta...... called The Ascension Celebration.... We had Teachers & Healers.... of all kinds... Music... Booths... etc...... It was a three day event..... Well, part of what I was doing at the event was public relations...... I had my little golf cart..... and walkie talkie..... And where ever there was something that needed to be taken care of...... I had access to get there..... Well, I was taking a break and walking around the booth area...... The energy was SOOOOOO incredible...... JUST so much well being and Love flowing throughout the whole thing...... SO I was a little High to say the least...... Anyway as I walked by this one booth this lady Mary.... calls me over..... and she tells me that this man she is talking to is having a horrible time...... Everything is going wrong for him.... He keeps feeling sick ... so forth and so on... Well, little Miss I Am as High as a Kite filled with Spirit Being........ Doesn't say word.... I Just walk up to him pull all the carp out of his Aura...... Ground him... Fill him with Golden light..... and walk away....... Sooooooo the day after the event is over... Me and a friend are driving in the cart to a meeting to finish things up..... I see this man....and he is waving to me.... so I stop and ask him how the rest of his time here went...... Oh wonderful he says....... I had a great time...... I stopped feeling sick and everything was beautiful....... He is glowing....with happiness...... Then he asks where Mary was.... I told him as I was pointing to the building the meeting was in..... The direction I was going....she was there ...... so he takes off & heads in that direction..... Well, his friend wanted to say Hi ... so the hello was very brief.... I was late to the meeting.... So I put my foot on the peddle, & turn my head ........ And here I am running over this GUY>>>>>>>> AAAAAHHHHHHHHHhhhhhh He had stopped to pickup a dime right in front of the cart !!!!!!! The WORST ... The WORST thing I can do is Hurt another Human Being..... in any form.... So here I am with the cart over this guys legs......my friend looks at me and says .... How could you do that????? I look at her in shock.... from those words..... He is bleeding and hurting so we rush him to the Hospital...... As I am sitting there I am having a very intense talk with God........ and asking a lot of questions .,,,,,,,, but the biggest and main one was....... Why did this happen????? Well, the answer that came..... was clear and to the point........ First--- I did a healing without asking his permission..... and Second was in doing that...... I interfered with his path....... of pain and suffering ....... and since I took that away, I was given the GIFT of returning it to him!!!!And FEELING the FULL IMPACT of what had happened!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! For me..... If someone comes across my path.... and is in pain.... or crippled or whatever it is...... I ask for Blessings for them along their journey of this lifetime.... I ask for the gift of the awareness for them to ask!!!! For Truly..... "Whatsoever you ask in the name of Christ shall be done." When I work with the Healing (now Reiki blended with Spiritual Counseling.... depending on the moment or need) it is because someone has asked me to do so..... And that is my path... I feel we each have are own in this..... and depending on our lessons is what will be our experience, as in everything else, I feel it applies to this also.... As my Reiki Master taught the same as did Bonnie's and with Ray's 3 principles 1. Be independent of the good opinion of others. 2. Have no attachment to the outcome. 3. No investment in power over others. And as Ray also wrote, some of the most important words I ever learned....."Not my will, but Thy Will" That, not so Etheric 2X4 has smacked way to many times not to get this one....... AAAAUUUUHHHHHHHHH But I still get excited when I see Miracles...... Beloved JJ..... For me in my small view of things..... It feels like that healing that took place with her.... .may have been,,,,,, for the Lesson of Faith for you..... and she may have come into this lifetime to be inflicted with this......... So that, in the Faith you turned to for this healing, she may have been returning this Real Gift of Faith ....... that you may have given her in the past.....!!! And What a Blessed Gift it Was for Both of You!!!!! I have no attachment about being right or wrong here..... It is just a feeling!!! So for me the answer is Yes one can be healed without asking for it......... But is it healthy for all concerned to do so??????? I thank you JJ for asking this question...... and I thank God, this morning giving me the time to explore it here in this body/mind...... So I may understand and express how it applies for me........ May your day be filled with the Blessing of Love..... The awareness to know it.... And the realization of that, which we truly are......! Miciella JJ writes: "This incident does answer one important question that some have asked. Does the one who is to be healed need to be aware of the healing process to be healed? Obviously the answer is no." Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13625 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Re: to heal by faith: Marilyn TheTripleGoddess wrote: "As a reiki practitioner, I was taught to usually ask the person ahead of time if they would like to receive healing energy.......... When I find myself in this situation I end up leaving it up to God's will and the will of the individual. The reiki masters who taught and initiated me covered this subject. They told me that in that kind of situation you can send a healing with a message. Like: "this healing is for you to take or reject concerning your highest good." This way it is more of a soul-to-soul message........." I think this is a very wise approach, Bonnie, as most of the time we just don't know what the will of the soul is for the ill person. There are so many things we need to be sensitive to before we can plunge in and heal effectively e.g. whether the person operates from the soul or personality, karmic and timing considerations etc. The Tibetan, through Alice Bailey, has said that most healing is carried out on the level of the personality (we can tell because it involves the personality being aware of itself during the healing) whereas soul energy functions unconsciously and is wielded by those who are in contact with their souls and who have adopted divine indifference. I would submit that most healers fall in the first category. If that is the case, then any healing they achieve is through manipulating pranic energy whereas a healer who has achieved soul contact heals utilizes higher energies, including the person's rays. Incidentally, when JJ said a person doesn't need to know of a healing (as in the case of his school friend), I think he would have been referring to the person's lower self. The soul must have been in on the act and approved of the healing otherwise JJ would have been interfering with the free will of his friend. The soul is all important in determining whether a healing is possible. If we can achieve soul contact ourselves, we are then in a better position to determine the will of the soul of the one who is ill and effect a healing that is appropriate to the real needs of the patient. Love Glenys -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Our duty is not to see through one another, but to see one another through. - Leonard Sweet Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13626 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Dreams and Work * Zia wrote: "What is so brilliant to me is we can 'think' any way we want, see any way we want..." You're absolutely right, Zia. And that includes seeing and thinking incorrectly and contrary to the purpose and will of our souls. "Did Jesus identify with Jesus or did he identify so totally with the Christ... no separation..." Point taken but it is hardly a powerful example to prove your point as you've used an example that is so overwhelmingly obvious. There is no separation, it is true, but we still live in a world of polarity and duality and subject to the laws of cause and effect. But we've done this one to death before, haven't we, Zia? :-) Love Glenys -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Our duty is not to see through one another, but to see one another through. - Leonard Sweet Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13627 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Loving greetings to One and All, Thank you JJ for responding to my posts. I do enjoy sharing all experiences even though it may not be understood nor accepted, and then when experienced and shared by many, it becomes understood. JJ: I would say this. That if all of Zia's enjoyments, as well as the rest of us, come from cause and effect that we are much too identified with duality to even consider any immediate departure. Zia: I would like to introduce that there is a 'departure' going on every second... JJ: Any release from cause and effect is pure theory that has never been demonstrated much less explained in any reasonable way. Zia: One's experience will be pure theory, and especially when something is demonstrated in the mind or consciousness, and the challenge is indeed to explain the experience in a way that all can understand. JJ: If it were possible to escape cause and effect for even a moment you would disappear body mind and soul from this reality and the world would be as if you had never existed. I'm not sure about the rest of you but this path has no interest for me. Zia: There is quite a truth in what you say here in part JJ, however again it is a matter of perspective. Science has discovered that the body is blinking on and off 14 times a second. The body is made of atoms. I suggest that while the body blinks on 14 times, we perceive the body as solid physical material object... we see it here. And when it blinks off 14 times a second we see 'nothing' indeed the body/mind/soul appears to have disappeared!! So nothing could look quite boring. However perhaps I can inpsire this path to look a little more interesting JJ. The world also blinks on and off 14 times a second... so it too is disappearing (hence Course in Miracles... disappearing out of here). So in the off blinks 14 times a second we are NOTHING here... yet EVERYTHING in spirit.. in God-consciousness. And our spirit reconnects to ALL THAT IS... and our body brain has the ability to receive all levels of consciousness. So we too through our spirit could receive EVERYTHING, the TOTALITY of ALL THAT IS 14 times a second. We say the void is nothing... because that's what it looks like physically... yet it is everything potentially, and when I am spirit I view the potentiality... all of everything... because God Consciousness already created everything. Thus I could return (blink back on physically) with the knowing of all levels of consciousness and the totality of God-consciousness, especially if I allow myself to consider the possibility of being conscious to that off blink, just as I am conscious in my dreams.... talk about inspiration WOW!! So what appears here to be nothing... in spirit is everything, and I automatically have access 14 times a second. And when I put this body to rest at night, then I have the opportunity to 'engage' those levels of consciousness 14 times a second as I engage physical reality 14 times a second during the day with my wonderful body sensing the physical input. At night or in pause mode, what about sensing my spirit and God-consciousness?? Physical 'looks' like nothing - spirit 'sees' everything... WOW I find that very exciting... now I can see the future potentials, dream dreams not even considered before and become the unlimited spirit being human.... wow 14 times a second is faster than a breath... so now where is cause and effect... very fast... and because it 'appears' in no time at all, well we get beyond cause and effect, duality, and so many other concepts.... Consciousness opens a vista so profound... starts simply by leaving the body, and letting us see we are not the body... then accessing various levels of consciousness until we recognize who and what are... and identify totally with that... awake aware and fully present both here and there!!! Well here is in there... so there is no separation here!! Now some books say 11 times a second others say 14 times a second... but are we ever really here??? LOL:) And what rate will our fabulous molecule vibrate at??? 14 times a second or faster...?? JJ: I suggest that we keep in touch with the reality of cause and effect to the extent that we can at least appreciate Zia's rainbow. Zia: And I would suggest that our body mind consciousness keeps providing us with the sensory data to enjoy rainbow's and flowers, while our spirit is also providing us with profound beauty of the TOTALITY OF ALL THAT IS, should we be open to receiving that as well... imagine 14 times a second... that's a lot of input!!! Thank you JJ for the opportunity of sharing my perceptions of both the physical and the spiritual worlds... that void is not full of nothing, but full of the potential of all things, and quite viewable by spirit. Being conscious and able to remember... these are the keys to the kingdom..... Humble servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13628 From: "Lawrence Kennon" Subject: [ OT ] Question from the archives... In archive #348, "Reincarnation Part V" JJ states: "In the Apocrypha we are warned that the way we live in one life can affect our bodies in a future life: "Woe to you, ungodly men, who have forsaken the law of the Most High Lord. AND IF YOU BE BORN, (indicating born in a future life) you shall be born in malediction, and if ye die, in malediction shall be your portion." Ecclesiasticus 4:11-12 Another example: "And I was a witty child and had received a good soul, and where as I was more good (in a previous life), I came to a body undefiled." Wisdom 8:19-20"." What/where are the books "Apocrypha" and "Wisdom"?? Thanks for your reply, lk "Take joy in this day the Lord has given" Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13629 From: Samu Karlsson Subject: OT - Poll in Time Magazine Genetically Modified Foods: Are You Afraid of Eating Them? http://www.pathfinder.com/time/daily/poll/0,2637,foodpoll,00.html Love, Samu chasethedogstarovertheseahomewheremytrueloveiswaitingformeropethesouthwind Samu Karlsson samu3@dlc.fi samu.karlsson@norpe.fi http://www.dlc.fi/~samu3 "Just remember not to forget and you'll be fine... but you already know this, don't you?" canvasthestarsharnessthemoonlightsoshecansafelygoroundthecapehorntovalparaiso Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13630 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: [ OT ] Question from the archives... lk, The Apocrypha formed a part of the King James Version of the Bible in 1611, and had been in English versions since 1382. The Puritans disapproved of these books and began to drop them from their Geneva Bible in 1600. These books, about 14 in all, never formed part of the Hebrew Bible. These books were part of the Septuagint, the Greek version of the Jewish Bible, and passed from it to the Latin Bible, the Vulgate (~400AD), which became the authorized Bible of Western Europe and England for a thousand years. My favorite book in the apocryphal writings is Second Esdras, sometimes called Fourth Esdras, and The Ezra Apocalypse. The symbolic story of a man, an eagle and a lion representing a latter- day god fascinates me. You can find the Apocrypha at most libraries, translation by Goodspeed. You can probably find the entire thing on the web as well. Love, Craig Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13631 From: Diane Linen Subject: Re: OT - Poll in Time Magazine Samu Karlsson wrote: "Genetically Modified Foods: Are You Afraid of Eating Them?" "http://www.pathfinder.com/time/daily/poll/0,2637,foodpoll,00.html" Frankenfood eh? Thanks for sending the url Samu. Diane Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13632 From: Maryellen Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow JJ writes: "If it were possible to escape cause and effect for even a moment you would disappear body mind and soul from this reality and the world would be as if you had never existed. I'm not sure about the rest of you but this path has no interest for me. "I suggest that we keep in touch with the reality of cause and effect to the extent that we can at least appreciate Zia's rainbow" Phwhew!!!!!!!!!! Thank you JJ and Bravo. I am so glad to hear this. I thought I was completely lost when I was trying to make sense of the absence of cause and effect. I was sitting here scratching my head thinking this concept was beyond my understanding. And frankly, this was the first time I'd heard a concept like this with the depth of understanding of Zia and had no idea what it actually meant. It felt very blurry. One more point I'd like to make is this. If we are "DECISION" then how can it be that cause and effect slip into Oneness? By being "decision" we have the divine power to make one (decision) which is "cause" and then see the effects, even if they are instantaneous!! Do you agree? Again, thank you all for your brilliance and wisdom. I am ecstatic to have found you! I AM Decision, Maryellen Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13633 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Don't worry about it one bit, Maryellen. Although we're a surprisingly harmonious group given our different philosophies and approaches to spiritual growth, we still have certain topics that are trigger points for some quite heated discussion at times. These include polarity and duality, karma (and the supposed transcendence of it), judgment and more latterly, cause and effect. After a time we exhaust ourselves with the discussion, realize that nothing more can be said, and move on to the next subject. But every now and then someone will try to relitigate their favourite topic and most of the others don't comment because it's already been done to death. I guess this means that newer people think we all agree with the viewpoint but it ain't necessarily so'. But you trusted your higher guidance and stuck to your guns. Good for you! That's what it's all about - learning to trust no one but yourself. Love Glenys -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Our duty is not to see through one another, but to see one another through. - Leonard Sweet Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13634 From: RWBH Subject: Re: [ OT ] Question from the archives... Craig Tholson wrote: "My favorite book in the apocryphal writings is Second Esdras, sometimes called Fourth Esdras, and The Ezra Apocalypse. The symbolic story of a man, an eagle and a lion representing a latter-day god fascinates me." I'm curious about this man/eagle/lion creature. I've never read the Ezra Apolcalypse. It does sound like a similar biblical critter: a man , an eagle, a lion, and a bull I believe... Craig...do you recognize this creature....maybe from Revelations?? Anyways...it's obviously related to the fixed cross of the Pisces Age: Man is Aquarius Eagle is Scorpio Lion is Leo Bull is Taurus In short, the four fixed signs ninety degrees apart each. Anybody interested in my suggestion that planet Earth rules the sign Taurus...and not Venus (ruler of Libra only)???? brian Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13935 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Hey Gang! At the risk of starting a rebellion, I have to honestly say that my gut feelings fall with Zia on this issue. Philosophically, it is at the root of reality. For most people, at a pragmatic level, it will never matter whether cause & effect fold into something higher than they can comprehend. I think of these things, as Zia certainly does, and I always have. Suffice it to say, there are levels of understanding that require correct interpretation of sensory input so as to continue on to the next attainment. It may not be appropriate to say there is no cause & effect, but it will most certainly become the case that cause and effect will be as the floor mat is to the kindergartner; it will have served its purpose. Those who continue to perceive that naps are necessary, thus requiring the need for the mat, will continue to take naps and appreciate their mats. Time is merely a reduction, or an unfolding, of a higher plane of being, where any concepts which require chronology as a basis (i.e., effect following cause), simply lose their significance. In other words, just because cause and effect are concrete absolutes in 4-space, it does not follow that it is the governing or only law of the omniverse, nor that dimensions don't exist where it is not applicable. I have much more to say, but don't have the time at present. Love, Craig Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13636 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow * Zia wrote: "One's experience will be pure theory," I have read this several times, Zia, in an attempt to try to understand your underlying meaning (as you have urged me to do in the past :-) but I've failed. A theory is abstract or untested knowledge or reasoning, an hypothesis, a conjectural view or idea. Experience involves a direct personal participation, involvement, feeling or observation etc. To suggest that one's experience is pure theory is beyond my understanding. JJ: "If it were possible to escape cause and effect for even a moment you would disappear body mind and soul from this reality and the world would be as if you had never existed. I'm not sure about the rest of you but this path has no interest for me." Zia: "There is quite a truth in what you say here in part JJ, however again it is a matter of perspective. Science has discovered that the body is blinking on and off 14 times a second. The body is made of atoms. I suggest that while the body blinks on 14 times, we perceive the body as solid physical material object... we see it here. And when it blinks off 14 times a second we see 'nothing' indeed the body/mind/soul appears to have disappeared!!" But experience does not prove this (that the body disappears or actually that it goes off, for that matter). "The world also blinks on and off 14 times a second... so it too is disappearing (hence Course in Miracles... disappearing out of here). So in the off blinks 14 times a second we are NOTHING here... yet EVERYTHING in spirit.. in God-consciousness." I need more information to understand this because it seems to me that you have taken an unproved theory not supported by any empirical evidence and extrapolated it to include all life. "And our spirit reconnects to ALL THAT IS... and our body brain has the ability to receive all levels of consciousness. "So we too through our spirit could receive EVERYTHING, the TOTALITY of ALL THAT IS 14 times a second." Can you give us any references for this new knowledge? And when you say we reconnect to All That is 14 times a second, do you mean the creator, all creation, the universe.........what? "We say the void is nothing... because that's what it looks like physically..." The void doesn't 'look' like anything because it can't be described in human terms. "Thus I could return (blink back on physically) with the knowing of all levels of consciousness and the totality of God-consciousness, especially if I allow myself to consider the possibility of being conscious to that off blink, just as I am conscious in my dreams.... talk about inspiration WOW!!" If it's that easy, why aren't more people doing it and why aren't lives changed as a result? If we could really do these things we would all be gurus after a few 14 second sessions. Why would we chose to stay here in physicality and polarity and duality (had to throw that in, Zia :-))) if we have achieved, or can achieve, 'the totality of God consciousness' so easily? Is it because we had to wait for a scientist to discover the possibility first? :-) "Physical 'looks' like nothing - spirit 'sees' everything... WOW I find that very exciting... now I can see the future potentials, dream dreams not even considered before and become the unlimited spirit being human...." You are already 'the unlimited spirit being human' with or without your 14 second blink off. "wow 14 times a second is faster than a breath... so now where is cause and effect... very fast... and because it 'appears' in no time at all, well we get beyond cause and effect, duality, and so many other concepts...." Well, leaving aside the fact that we aren't able to absorb anything faster than a second (JJ - correct me if I'm wrong), no matter how fast it took place, there is still a gap in time and a resultant cause and effect. Furthermore, you are applying the time/space continuum of the lower worlds to the higher realms where everything is different "Consciousness opens a vista so profound... starts simply by leaving the body, and letting us see we are not the body... then accessing various levels of consciousness until we recognize who and what are..." The difficulty I have with that theory is that I chose to learn the truth of who I am in physicality. If I wanted to learn it at a higher level of consciousness I wouldn't have bothered throwing my hat in the ring to come to Planet Earth. Why, having got here, would I want to waste my time attempting to live in other dimensions on a regular basis when there is still so much stuff to learn here. I'd feel as if I was cheating myself. "and identify totally with that... awake aware and fully present both here and there!!! Well here is in there... so there is no separation here!!" I think that we've had this discussion before as well. We are where our consciousness is. I have yet to meet anyone who is 'awake, aware and fully present both here and there' (and by 'there' I assume you mean 'everywhere'). But maybe we're a bit backward here in New Zealand :) "Now some books say 11 times a second others say 14 times a second... but are we ever really here??? LOL:)" We I have to agree that I have meet people who aren't here....or there...or anywhere, for that matter. There's a part of me that quite envies crazy people - the happy crazies, that is. "And what rate will our fabulous molecule vibrate at??? 14 times a second or faster...??" Oh no, so the molecules are going to disappear 14 times a second as well!? So we'll form molecules that won't really be here but in the Land of Oz somewhere over the rainbow (not that I don't appreciate rainbows :-) I would love to be convinced of your arguments, Zia, and it sounds a nice way to live, being neither here nor there. It would save me having to work out whether I'm Arthur or Martha when I lose my keys (now I know where they've gone when they disappear 14 times a second) or working out whether I'm in a rock or a hard place when I'm in difficulties. The downside of your theory is that I would be both Arthur and Martha at the same time and in both a rock *and* a hard place. Quelle horreur! LOL Love Glenys -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Our duty is not to see through one another, but to see one another through. - Leonard Sweet Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13637 From: Rick Audette Subject: Re: The adventure continues "I've check my typing over and over and have put in the correct address as you gave it. So how do I get to read comics?" Sorry Marylin, The problem seems to be with xoom.com. We tried loading the page from computers at the office and haven't been able to get in there either. I noticed that, even at home, I've been having a hard time loading any pages from xoom for the last few days. Hopefully, they will soon clear up the problems. To help on my end, I have reduced the page size, to make it easier to load. The comic is very heavy on the graphics and that may cause some problems loading on some systems. Keep trying, it may load better during parts of the day when net traffic is less congested (whenever that might be). Love, Rick -- ICQ # 19753992 visit my web pages at http://www.ont.com/users/rea1/ The only really natural diet http://www.neanderthin.com have you read "The Immortal" http://www.freeread.com *:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:* I'm only in it for the thrill Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13638 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Craig Tholson wrote: "In other words, just because cause and effect are concrete absolutes in 4-space, it does not follow that it is the governing or only law of the omniverse, nor that dimensions don't exist where it is not applicable." So do you not accept that the law of cause and effect is the first cause and responsible for all that is, Craig? For it may be that the differences between some of us on this matter are, as is so often the case, due to differences of definition. If you accept it *is* the first cause, then there is nothing created where it is not applicable. Anything that exists (an effect), had to have a cause. Love Glenys -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Our duty is not to see through one another, but to see one another through. - Leonard Sweet Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13639 From: Diane Linen Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Glenys, Maybe I'm interpreting Zia's comments wrongly but I think she's referring to the earth's vibration at its present one. It used to vibrate at about 7 and now it's increased to the 14 times a second. I don't think it's just a theory that there is no such thing as 'solids.' When I was a kid I didn't understand how a chair could not be 'solid.' It looked solid to me and felt solid to me but the atoms are spaced apart so what 'seems' solid really isn't. So if it's vibrating, then there is also a period when it's not vibrating and that is the off part of her comment. That's about as far as I can think right now. ;) Diane * Zia wrote: "One's experience will be pure theory," Glenys Lowery wrote: "I have read this several times, Zia, in an attempt to try to understand your underlying meaning (as you have urged me to do in the past :-) but I've failed." Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13640 From: Rick Audette Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Zia says, "The world also blinks on and off 14 times a second... so it too is disappearing (hence Course in Miracles... disappearing out of here). So in the off blinks 14 times a second we are NOTHING here... yet EVERYTHING in spirit.. in God-consciousness." This is one point where the CIM is way off the mark. Video cameras can capture many more frames per second than this and when played back we see something on each frame. A sound of 14 cps is generally not audible but our bodies still respond to hearing it (falls asleep). A light, blinking at 14 times per second is very noticeable and, if your theory was right, it would be easy to phase the light and see "nothing", which, of course, can't be done. If my physical brain were to start blinking on and off at 14 times per second, I'd take that as a sign that I need to go to Wendy's and order a hamburger :) Rick -- ICQ # 19753992 visit my web pages at http://www.ont.com/users/rea1/ The only really natural diet http://www.neanderthin.com have you read "The Immortal" http://www.freeread.com *:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:* I'm only in it for the thrill Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13641 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Loving greetings to One and All, Ahhhh it is to be expected that not all with see from the same perspective. This does not make one perspective more correct than another nor discredit one, simply because others cannot see it. There is another step to consider and I have given the simplest perception with the 14 times a second blinking on and off of the physical. When we continue to simply identify and perceive from the physical, one is saying that all I am is body, and nothing else. When we can consider and then even perceive from the Spirit that we truly are and always have been, then I would ask you to consider that Spirit is ALL we truly are... and if that is the case, well spirit is not blinking on and off in actuality... that is a simple example to get us to see the body for what it really is... thus imagine now that you are totally spirit, monitoring the physical senses of this body 14 times a second, and that may seem like a lot to a body perspective, but may not be to spirit... and what else is Spirit that I am doing and aware and conscious of...?? Well unless we even can consider the possibility, we cannot bring it into our reality for gaining experience and understanding. Who and what are you as the body blinks off, and the world blinks off... and it matters not to me whether you think I am absurd, or that I don't think like everyone else.. and actually the latter is certainly true, and the experiences that I have gained, allow me to see 'life' quite differently..... especially the belief in death... of the body. Why it could be dying 14 times a second!!! Hahaha, very painless! Christ said his kingdom was not of this world... would it ever be... could it ever be??? The Bible and many 'spiritual books' are mostly metaphor.. for what... the experience within one's mind, and coming to know who and what we are... it is an exciting journey, and not one too many take on faith, yet will have the opportunity to experience, and thus see clearly for themselves. That is the great purpose of Life to me. Seeing the body truly for what it is... atoms blinking on and off filled mostly with... yes you guessed it ... EMPTY SPACE.... what a marvel creation is!! Humble servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13642 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Thanks Diane, I wondered whether Zia was talking about Greg Bradon's theories in his book Awakening to Zero Point as he talks about the base resonant frequency of earth which is usually about 8Hz increasing towards a Fibonacci target frequency of 13Hz. He has concluded that it means we are heading for a shift, including a polar shift, a 'disassociation' of matter that cannot keep up with the new vibration and new states of consciousness where we will experience everything at once as we move into the 4th dimension. He is closely associated with Drunvalo Melchizedek who has similar theories I used to be very impressed with Braddon. I have his books and videos and read and watched them several times. It was only after I decided to study his theories in greater detail that I saw that not all of the information he presented as fact had been proved and some of it had been disproved. The best example of of such 'scientific' theories being taken up by new age gurus and given spiritual connotations was the impending Photon Belt theory of a few years ago. We were also destined to achieve total consciousness on all levels when it arrived and the worst part of it was that the theory was based on a lie, the gurus knew it was lie and yet still, they continued to promulgate it. If anyone's interested I have an essay describing the whole process, starting with Barbara Hand Clow's book, The Pleiadian Agenda of 1992. So I apologize if I seem cynical or hard to convince, Diane. It's just that I like to have reasonably conclusive evidence before I accept anything as scientific fact and not a mere parroting of untested theories (at best) or disinformation (at worst). Love Glenys Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13643 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow * Zia wrote: "Who and what are you as the body blinks off, and the world blinks off... and it matters not to me whether you think I am absurd, or that I don't think like everyone else.." I certainly don't think you're absurd, Zia, and I agree with you that it is great to consider all points of view. I also admire people who think outside the box. All I wanted was to seek further clarification of your views by asking certain questions. I hope you'll be able to find the time to answer them. Love Glenys -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- At age 20, we worry about what others think of us. At 40, we don't care what they think of us. At 60, we discover they haven't been thinking of us at all. - Ann Landers Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-04/13644 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Hi Glenys, I do not believe there was a first cause really. I do believe you can use the concept of a first cause to move through some seeming barriers of understanding. But that is all. Which came first? the chicken or the egg? I do not believe there ever was a time when both chicken and egg did not exist. Same with apple seed and apple tree. Same with you and me. If we had a beginning then we'll have an ending. You can not apply the law of correspondences to a "first cause." For there never was a first cause. I am as familiar with cause and effect as anyone on the list. Today I was taking a brake caliper off my 1990 Mercury and was banging on a hex wrench with my palm. This was the cause. The effect was ripped flesh on the palm of my hand, as I walked away wondering why I thought my palm was a hammer. I have fathered seven children and I am damned well familiar with the cause and effect of such. Anyone who has experienced a full-fledged epiphany (whatever that is) knows that time can quite literally stand still. You are then in both cause and effect simultaneously. Metaphysics isn't the only field to recognize this. Einstein's Special Relativity was theory 90 years ago. Now we know for a fact that velocities approaching the speed of light dilate time. Any enlightened physicist will tell you that time is merely a tool in which cause and effect can occur. Go fast enough, and time absolutely stands still when measured from another reference frame. If time is relative, THEN SO ALSO IS CAUSE AND EFFECT. If I travel at 98% of the speed of light and am gone for twenty years, when I get back it will be one hundred years later in all of you guys' reference frame. But I will have aged only 20 years, while all of you are dead and reincarnated. What was cause and effect for you, never caught me. I'm still a young man while all of you are dead! Thus, cause and effect are relative. They are not absolutes. They can be cheated, if you will. If puny little man can demonstrate time dilation in experiments, do you not suppose the Gods have mastered this. Yes. They have and we are living proof that if you go back in time you can alter your own future. Thus, cause and effect are easily manipulated and used to create, through the illusion of the real. Cause and effect is a step-down transformer of sorts, used by the Gods to demonstrate the power of will. When this class is over, we will undoubtedly be off to others. The reason there is no judgment, is simply because the cause and effects in this virtual reality will evaporate with this class when it has served its purpose. What will endure is a more highly evolved being, not a being forever trapped in a holographic video game. Love, Craig "Glenys Lowery" writes: "So do you not accept that the law of cause and effect is the first cause and responsible for all that is, Craig? For it may be that the differences between some of us on this matter are, as is so often the case, due to differences of definition. 'If you accept it *is* the first cause, then there is nothing created where it is not applicable. Anything that exists (an effect), had to have a cause." Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13645 From: Diane Linen Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Glenys, Zia would have to answer if that was what she meant. I just interpreted it as that so it's my own idea not hers that was in my post. I have read that instruments have been able to measure the new increased resonance. The days 'do' seem to go by altogether too swiftly for me. Time is relative. I've attended lectures where it was unending. ;) Diane Glenys Lowery wrote: "I wondered whether Zia was talking about Greg Bradon's theories in his book Awakening to Zero Point as he talks about the base resonant frequency of earth which is usually about 8Hz increasing towards a Fibonacci target frequency of 13Hz." Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13646 From: Diane Linen Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow As to the photon belt, I'm very doubtful. Diane Glenys Lowery wrote: "I used to be very impressed with Braddon. I have his books and videos and read and watched them several times. It was only after I decided to study his theories in greater detail that I saw that not all of the information he presented as fact had been proved and some of it had been disproved. The best example of such 'scientific' theories being taken up by new age gurus and given spiritual connotations was the impending Photon Belt theory of a few years ago. We were also destined to achieve total consciousness on all levels when it arrived and the worst part of it was that the theory was based on a lie, the gurus knew it was lie and yet still, they continued to promulgate it. If anyone's interested I have an essay describing the whole process, starting with Barbara Hand Clow's book, The Pleiadian Agenda of 1992." Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13647 From: Diane Linen Subject: Schumann Resonance (OT) What is the Schumann Resonance? The Schumann Resonances are quasi-standing electromagnetic waves that exist in the Earth's 'electromagnetic' cavity (the space between the surface of the Earth and the Ionosphere). Like waves on a string, they are not present all the time, but have to be 'excited' to be observed. They are not caused by anything internal to the Earth, its crust or its core. They seem to be related to electrical activity in the atmosphere, particularly during times of intense lightning activity. They occur at several frequencies, specifically 7.8 (strongest), 14, 20, 26, 33, 39 and 45 (weakest) Hertz, with a daily variation of about ? 0.5 Hertz. So long as the properties of Earth's electromagnetic cavity remains about the same, these frequencies remain the same. Presumably there is some change due to the solar sunspot cycle as the Earth's ionosphere changes in response to the 11-year cycle of solar activity. The resonant properties of this terrestrial cavity were first predicted by the German physicist W. O. Schumann between 1952 and 1957, and first detected in 1954. Depending on your point of view, living beings either evolved in this natural electromagnetic environment or were created with Divine Intelligence to live in harmony with it. One thing is certain: Since life began, the Earth has been surrounding all living things with this natural frequency pulsation. Many experts believe that the wide spectrum of artificial man-made EMF radiation masks the natural beneficial frequency of the Earth. Electropollution may cause us to feel more stressed, fatigued and "out of balance." Laboratory research has shown that exposing living cells to the Schumann Resonance had the effect of shielding them from ambient EMFs, allowing the cells to increase their immune protection, and decrease the absorption of depression-inducing chemicals. Some researchers believe that by producing a 7.83 Hz pulse with a scalar field generator (Schumann device), we can counter the effects of the irritating man-made fields. By replicating the Earth's natural rhythm, we may be providing ourselves (at least in our immediate vicinity) with a more healthy environment. Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13648 From: Diane Linen Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow I *think* therefore I *am*. Diane Glenys Lowery wrote: "If you accept it *is* the first cause, then there is nothing created where it is not applicable. Anything that exists (an effect), had to have a cause." Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13649 From: "John Wayne Kline" Subject: Over the Rainbow Well I said I wasn't going to touch this one with a ten foot pole but here I go. LOL Glenys as usual, and then Rick have triggered my response button. Glenys has carried the flag all day valiantly and according to Will. I have personally duplicated every experiment that Drunvalo Melchesidek has put out, and found some merit on the surface, and the depths of Illusion underneath. I have yet to see even one of his Prophecies prove true. As I said, I have successfully duplicated every experiment he has ever made public and I'm still in this dimension, not the fifth or sixth. The only thing that could duplicate what Zia has alluded to is sub atomic particles, which do seem to fade in and out of perception in a tunnel accelerator. This is simply because of a shift in energy, and rate of vibration. This rate of vibration is incomprehensible. What I find so comical is this. For what Zia is saying to occur in the Cosmic Keyboard the rate of vibration would have to be in excess of 4,611,686,018,427,387,904 vibration per second. When I say beyond I mean that the above number is the rate of vibration for x-rays, from that point on we are dealing with the 62nd and above octaves of the Cosmic Keyboard and it is incomprehensible to say the least. Now the Key is that the rate of vibration of the Soul is in this range or above but at no time would all the particles be blinking at the same time, so nothing would ever disappear under these circumstances. There is a way to make the body disappear but none of the New Age Theories I've ever seen published is it. The Masters including the Christ could easily manipulate free electrons, form a molecular cloud, cause that cloud to engulf them, and change the color of the cloud to match any surroundings they were in to appear invisible, or cause the cloud to be highly visible, usually blue, violet, and appear in the cloud to anyone, anyplace, anytime. If you give what I said some serious thought you will easily see that cause, and effect are obvious in the process, and there is nothing supernatural about it. The same principle which underlies this, also underlies the ability to perform many kinds of so called miracles and our teacher JJ is well aware off. This brings us to another point. The highest teachings that have ever been released to Initiates have always clearly presented the fact that even the highest masters are not above karma. Kut Hu Mi, Morya EL, and Dwjahl Kuhl have all made this clear to their students. There is a point where Karma becomes Grace, and this is the point where the Initiate truly has become an unobstructed receptacle for the Will, or Purpose of God, which is Above Love. Love is dependant on Purpose, Purpose is not dependant on Love. There are only two Wills in the Universe, The Will of Man, and the Will of God. Let all your actions be according to Will, this is the Only Law there is. This in itself implies Karma, and Cause and Effect. Love cannot exist without its cause which is Purpose. Anything else is Absurd, and Illusion, or Glamour. It is not a problem to not understand, although it is often dangerous to misunderstand. It has be the damnation of the World down through history, and is the very reason that the Kingdom of God has not been established. If there were not cause and effect, there would be no universe to begin with. Illusion can not be overcome through, another illusion. Your Friend, John Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13650 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Diane Linen wrote: "I have read that instruments have been able to measure the new increased resonance." I'm sure they do. It's just that some of the conclusions reached as a result of the data collected stretch my credibility somewhat. Also, just as a point of clarification, this is not a new phenomena. It has happened several times in the earth's history. And wouldn't you know it.......we're still here...living in the third dimension, with most of the world still struggling to achieve partial consciousness, let alone total consciousness. But maybe this time it will be different...;-))) Watch out void, here I come. < zap......... bye, bye, Glenys > Love Glenys -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- At age 20, we worry about what others think of us. At 40, we don't care what they think of us. At 60, we discover they haven't been thinking of us at all. - Ann Landers Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13651 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow Diane Linen wrote: "I *think* therefore I *am*." Or to put it another way........ "To do is to be" - Camus "To be is to do" - Sartre "Do be do be do" - Sinatra LOL! Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13652 From: Diane Linen Subject: Re: Appreciating the Rainbow I'm obviously missing your point Glenys. I am not in any way saying that we are leaving this dimension if that's what you mean. I don't think I said that. It's 3:20am but I swear I don't recall saying we are moving to another dimension; just that there has been an increase in the earths' vibrations. It probably goes through cycles where it speeds up and slows down just as it heats up and cools down. Diane Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13653 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: The First Law I thought it might be useful to the newer members to repost one of JJ's emails on the Law of Cause and Effect as it's become a discussion topic again. Apologies to those who aren't interested in repeat performances. Love Glenys The First Law I wasn't planning on writing about karma tonight, but since it seems like such a hot topic here and still unresolved I thought I would add a few thoughts. Actually karma is somewhat on topic because its understanding can be enhanced through the use of the Law of correspondences, our current topic. The law of Karma is the Law of Cause and Effect. There can be no cause unless there is a corresponding effect for that is what a cause is. The first definition of a cause in The American Heritage Dictionary is: "The producer of an effect, result, or consequence." The same dictionary gives as the first definition of effect as: "Something brought about by a cause or an agent; a result." Therefore, by definition there can be no effect without cause and there can be no cause without producing an effect. Now some have said that Karma, or the Law of Cause and Effect can be negated or eliminated. Some say that it only exists because we are attached to it or because we have judgment within us. Others say that we merely must rise above the illusion of this world and Karma will cease. Do you realize what it would mean to escape karma to the extent that karma would no longer exist? If karma no longer exists for you this means you would cease to exist. Non-existence is to have no power to initiate cause and effect. And non existence is impossible; therefore, total escape from karma is impossible. If you are beyond cause and effect you are beyond the power to even be alive. DK through Alice A. Bailey tells us that the Masters do not eliminate the Law of Karma. Instead they learn to "wield the law." In other words they create causes so the effects that result are desired effects rather than undesirable ones. In this way they are free from unpredictable karma. In other words, they are no longer victims of the law as regular humanity is. A regular human in his use of karma is a little like a novice going to Las Vegas to gamble at blackjack.. The odds are against him because he does not understand the game and does not realize that because of his ignorance the longer he plays the more he will lose. He who learns to master karma is a little like the master gambler who learns how to count the cards which will give him control over the game. In both cases the law of cause and effect is in full force, but in the latter case the Master Gambler uses the law instead of Being used by the law. Is cause and effect only applicable in the worlds of form? Answer: It would have to be applicable in all worlds because the worlds of form are an effect of energy which was an originating cause before the worlds were created. In the beginning there was God and God Itself was a cause and creation is the effect. Thus the first act of the invisible God was the creation of karma. To those who say they can exist apart from karma, let me put forth this challenge. I can show you billions of examples of karma (cause and effect). But can you show me even one example of anything that is real that creates no cause and effect? It takes a tremendous leap of faith to believe so strongly in that for which no example can be given. Why would someone believe in a place beyond cause and effect if such a place cannot be demonstrated internally or externally??? You can in deep meditation attempt to withdraw into perfect stillness, but even this meditation (cause) has the effect of peace or stillness of thought. Not only does logic, experience and the law of correspondences bear witness to the eternal existence of cause and effect but all the writings revealed by the teachings of the Masters as well as the scriptures agree. The Bible: Gal 6:5 For every man shall bear his own burden. Gal 6:6 Let him that is taught in the word communicate unto him that teacheth in all good things. Gal 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. Gal 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. Gal 6:9 And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not. Note here that Karma extends beyond the physical for it says: "He that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting." The Book of Mormon: "For it must needs be, that there is an opposition in all things. If not so, my first-born in the wilderness, righteousness could not be brought to pass, neither wickedness, neither holiness nor misery, neither good nor bad. Wherefore, all things must needs be a compound in one; wherefore, if it should be one body it must needs remain as dead, having no life neither death, nor corruption nor incorruption, happiness nor misery, neither sense nor insensibility. "Wherefore, it must needs have been created for a thing of naught; wherefore there would have been no purpose in the end of its creation. Wherefore, this thing must needs destroy the wisdom of God and his eternal purposes, and also the power, and the mercy, and the justice of God. "And if ye shall say there is no law, ye shall also say there is no sin. If ye shall say there is no sin, ye shall also say there is no righteousness. And if there be no righteousness there be no happiness. And if there be no righteousness nor happiness there be no punishment nor misery. And if these things are not there is no God. And if there is no God we are not, neither the earth; for there could have been no creation of things, neither to act nor to be acted upon; wherefore, all things must have vanished away." II Nephi 2:11-13 Note that without karma, cause and effect there would be no creation, no you and me and no God for God is the First Cause, the first agent of karma. A Course In Miracles: "If I intervened between your thoughts and their results, I would be tampering with a basic law of cause and effect; the most fundamental law there is." Text Pg 27 "Think not you understand anything until you pass the test of perfect peace, for peace and understanding go together and never can be found alone. 5 Each brings the other with it, for it is the law of God they be not separate. 6 They are cause and effect, each to the other, so where one is absent the other cannot be." Text Pg 278 " Nothing can have effects without a cause, and to confuse the two is merely to fail to understand them both." Text Pg 420 Alice A Bailey; "As I write this instruction I would call your attention to the subject of karma. There comes ever in the life of a disciple and in the soul's experience some one particular life wherein the Law of Cause and Effect assumes importance in the consciousness. From that life and that moment, the disciple begins to deal with karma, consciously and definitely. He learns to recognize it when events and happenings come which require understanding and which evoke questioning; he begins to study the quality of his radiation as a karmic agent, and therefore he becomes the maker and constructor, in a new and important sense, of his own destiny and future. His reactions to life and circumstances cease to be simply emotional in nature and become deliberately dictated by conscious observation; they then have in them a significant quality of preparation which is absent from the life of the average man. For the remainder of this life, therefore, I would ask you to carry the theme of karmic decision and of preparation for the future ever in your consciousness; I would ask you always to take action with as full an understanding of the probable following effects as you can manage to achieve, and to make a real effort to study the Law of Consequence and Compensation." "It is not my intention to explain or elaborate the subject of Karma. This occult yet fundamentally exoteric theme, the Law of Cause and Effect, evokes a general recognition when called by this name. When called the Law of Karma, it is immediately regarded as mysterious, Oriental and new. Called (as it sometimes is) the Law of Retribution, an entirely erroneous connotation has become attached to it. Today, the karma of humanity is descending upon it. I would remind you, however, that the continuous emphasis laid upon the malevolent aspects of karma conveys a wrong impression and negates the full grasp of the truth. There is as much good karma as there is bad; even in the present world situation, the good karma emanating from the soul of humanity balances the evil which comes from the material aspect and is continuously over-emphasised. It is the rhythm of matter in contradistinction to the rhythm of the soul, and these constitute the initiating causes of the present conflict, both in individual lives and in the general world situation. When this is properly grasped, the true picture may emerge in your hearts and minds with greater clarity." "A steady endeavour to see the reality in every form. This literally involves a study of the law of cause and effect, or karma, the object of the karmic law being to bring the opposite pole of Spirit, matter, into strict conformity with the requirements of spirit so that matter and form can perfectly express the nature of spirit." JJ DK goes on to tell us that the earth is not a sacred planet because Sanat Kumara himself is somewhat of a rebel from a cosmic point of view and has some effects that he must deal with before the planet can take the needed initiation. Even high entities who have learned to use the law of karma in a positive sense cannot let their guard down, for one of the Kumaras that came to the earth with the Ancient of Days (called Lucifer by Christians) fell from his lofty station when he did not wield the law with wisdom. Copyright 2000 By J.J. Dewey All rights Reserved Post No. keys-l: /2000-04-05/13654 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: More on karma More on karma (from JJ's email entitled Back to Correspondences http://www.dlc.fi/~samu3/JJArchives/JJ795.html Moving on here I will make one more statement on the much discussed topic of karma. It seems that some believe that if we can just realize that from the aspect of the Eternal Now that cause and effect is happening at the same time that will give us some type of mystical power of transcendence over this law. That is like saying that when you take a trip that you begin and end the trip at he same time from a higher viewpoint. OK. Does this knowledge change anything for us in this world? Would this knowledge give me the power to make a 14 hour drive to California in an instant because the beginning and end is one in some mystical reality? If we could attain this power by just realizing this oneness in the Eternal Now then I wouldn't even have to spend time with cause and effect in writing this post, for th