2000 - WEEK 10 Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-06/12912 From: "James A. Clark.Jr." Subject: Re: Imagine Applying the Laws of Correspondences.. I hope I'm not out on a limb here thinking that does it ring true in the soul what we have been asked to look at or correspond to truth...I do not feel that this way of thinking is correct that Christ will come down in His wrath and rapture away the Bible thumper..aka born agains...(LOL) sorry if it offends anyone...If He is giving us and anyone else for that matter these revelations, teachings of Light like the Song of the 144,000 the Immortal and all the work that has been going on Molecular Structure which are building for the future, etc.. it really doesn't fit.. It is more inline with those who fell that their affinity with Christ they imagine to make themselves special attributing special treatment and no work on their part to help others live in a Christ oriented way... Self serving is what I feel. There are world changes coming true enough for the Spirit to make a new way for the progress of humanity the raising up in vibration of all sure no doubt some things have to give.. new wine in a new wine skin. But the idea of I'm born again, perfect..nope... If God is becoming... and we all are becoming, there is no perfection static state like what the people attribute to being born again. God's plan is unfolding and we are not only witnessing this but participating in it, seeking an inner yes to affirm the truth we hear, working with the light and linking up to the others who work with light and who are "above us in light" so that the energies of God flow and uplift the rest.. is not like being taken in rapture at all but an active participation in the transformation of the Second coming of Christ on earth. If it were true.. why then are we studying thinking trying to create a way for new things to come which are being told to us are coming? why do we try to go to New Jerusalem, why seek to learn the principles? enough..let some other soul take the floor.. James Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-06/12913 From: John Kosior Subject: (OT) Help With NonProfit Organizations Hi Folks, This is really off topic, but at the same time I couldn't think of a better forum to ask for help with the establishment of a not for profit organization. I know some of you have looked into this for the Keysters operation and I hope that perhaps some of you can help inform me in this area. First allow me to explain the intention I have for this endeavor. Though it's not necessarily "spiritual" in nature, I believe that anything any of us would put our hand to doing would carry with it the potential of many physical and spiritual benefits. What I'm intending to initiate is a consumer organization, beginning here in the Orlando, Fl area, then expanding nationwide. The purpose of which is to band together as many folks as I can who are interested in addressing the obscenely rising prices of almost all goods and services in this country. I have felt the pinch probably harder than most, being a freelance musician (historically not a highly profitable arena :). But the vision I have for this operation is to gather a huge number of petitioners who are willing to sign their names to this "Consumer Alliance", which will then use its power in numbers to confront the largest corporations, first with letters of intent, and if necessary, actions such as boycotts of particular goods and/or services which are rapidly becoming impossible for many consumers to afford. So far, as I have used this as a subject of conversation with many folks I have met, I have received only positive feedback and a willingness on their part to join the organization. So if anyone here has knowledge or expertise in setting up this type of not for profit organization, I would greatly appreciate all the help I could get. And please respond to me privately so that we don't clog up the list with this type of information. My Email address is: jkosior@mindspring.com I would also appreciate hearing any one of your opinions as to the veracity of this idea. And of course, your prayerful support would be very greatly appreciated. Perhaps together we can help to alleviate the suffering of those least able (the poor) to keep up with these rising costs, while also demonstrating that together, we DO have the ability to create positive change in our society. Just as we may one day create the establishment of God's Kingdom on earth. Thanks in advance to each of you for any form of help you might be willing to offer. It is appreciated far more than I could ever express in mere words. In Peace and Love, John Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-06/12914 From: Mark D Williams Subject: Song in Icelandic for Viggi Song of the 144,000 Icelandic *** Vid thokkum ther, Fadir, fyrir ad hafa birt okkurverndandi heimslj?s; thittog ? thvi lj?si eralgjor vernd gegn ollumeydandi oflum; thvi ad heilagur andin?laegdar thinnar gagntekur okkuri thessu lj?si, og hvar sem vid viljumad thad lj?s lysi. *** Vid thokkum ther, Fadir, fyrir ad hafa fyllt okkurverndandi ?stareldi thinum; og i theirri ?st eralgjor vernd gegn ollumeydandi hugsunum og kenndum; og ad vitundin um Krister vakin i okkur i thessari ?stog hvar sem vid viljumad s? ?st kvikni. *** Vid thokkum ther, Fadir, ad thu ert i okkur og ad vid erum i th?rad; um okkur eru fyrirmaeli thin send ? vaengjum m?ttarins; svo ad vilji thinn verdi ? jordusvo sem ? himnum; ad gegnum okkur erulj?s thitt og ?st thin og m?ttur thinnstadfest ollum sonum og daetrum mannanna. *** http://members.xoom.com/keysarchive/song-ice.html Love, Light and Power to you, Viggi. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12915 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: Song in Icelandic for Viggi Loving greetings, Wow, that's great Mark, the Song in Icelandic... I just wish there was a phonetic version so I could sing it in his language. The focus with him this morning in NJ (and by the way many others including Diane) was so beautiful... I lost all track of time... and where I was in the song... as I was so caught up with the individuals. Ahhh Viggi... my heart soul and spirit are with you. Loving servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12916 From: "Rapter" Subject: Real Karma I believe that two new age authors (Agartha/Mentor and Jane Roberts/Seth.) wrote about Karma being transmuted by the giving of love through the active energy of the heart centre. These authors did not say that Karma was lessened by this action, but only that Karma was paid back in a heightened or quickened manner. Somehow these writings have been misinterpreted to mean that Karma can be dispersed with by simply adopting love as an idea and not as an active ingredient that requires action on the part of the individual. Keith Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12917 From: xavier Subject: Re: (OT) Help With NonProfit Organizations Original message from: John K "I would also appreciate hearing any one of your opinions as to the veracity of this idea." Don't fight evil, build good. Energy follows thought. (hey just a comment okay? no judgment, just a quick feeling) My vision is to build a sounder business than what exists today, thus reducing prices and enhancing quality. Showing people how to do it, through example, instead of attacking what exists. But I am a no doer, remember. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12918 From: xavier Subject: OT Re: Real Karma "Rapter" writes: "I believe that two new age authors (Agartha/Mentor and Jane Roberts/Seth.) wrote about Karma being transmuted by the giving of love through the active energy of the heart centre. These authors did not say that Karma was lessened by this action, but only that Karma was paid back in a heightened or quickened manner. Somehow these writings have been misinterpreted to mean that Karma can be dispersed with by simply adopting love as an idea and not as an active ingredient that requires action on the part of the individual. Keith" I like this comment very much. This might show where the delusions took form in new age thought. The truth (as I gleaned it) is that grace is "above" laws, which means that in a perfect (realized, mastered) state one doesn't create personal karma. In fact the guy that wrote Seth might have tapped into the same knowledge, put it into some words that then were falsely interpreted? BTW, I have a book of Seth, I didn't get the feeling (only had a short look) that it was so accurate. But this comment of yours is very interesting. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12919 From: J J Dewey Subject: Discovering With Correspondence I liked Brian's comment about the word MAGI being incorporated into imagine. It is not a coincidence that we have many hidden messages within there words we use - more than even the enlightened realize. Rick asks: "I got the impression, from earlier teachings on the list, that you said we were always Human. The above seems to say that our consciousness evolves up through the spectrum of Kingdoms. So, I'm not clear, yet, on just what we are. "Is a human life one that has grown through mineral, plant and animal forms or is it a collective made up of millions of smaller lives. Each of the countless little lives, that make up the One Life, has to go through it's own growth process, but each IS also the One Life." JJ In a way we have evolved through all the kingdoms because that which has combined to create a vehicle for our expression has come from all the lower kingdoms. However that intelligence which is you never incarnated on the earth until the lower lives prepared a vehicle of expression for you. Remember, you are not your body, your feelings pr even your mind. You are an idea in the mind of God which has been given the power of Decision. That idea which is you does not fit into the idea of a plant. You would not be happy there with such limitations. However the idea of the plant is happy to be a plant until it reaches relative perfection. We are happy to be human until we reach our relative perfection and then we seek to join with others to become a part of a greater life while keeping our identity as a unique self merging with the whole. Rick continues by comparing us to a hard drive with cooperating programs. The computer itself is a good correspondence. Let us compare the computer to a human life. Within your computer are many programs. These are like lesser lives (animal type) working in "isolated unity" to make a complete whole. Now on my Mac each program has a sub program called "extensions." These are subprograms that make the larger programs function with greater efficiency. We can correspond these to plant life. Finally we have the hardware composed of metal, glass and silicon. This compares to the mineral kingdom. These three kingdoms on our computers create the whole instrument, but no memory chip will ever evolve into a whole computer. No word processor will ever change into the whole machine. The word processor though after many versions will reach relative perfection and blend in with the functioning of the whole. Living things have an advantage over computer parts in that they become one in consciousness with the greater whole which is a greater experience than the mere realization that you are just a part of a greater whole. If you contemplate the lesser lives within your own body you can sense their desire to know you and in a sense you are a god to them and they seek to be one with their god. Their god also should seek to be one with them. This is one of the secrets of perfect health. The Question "Now we have basically concluded that this Law (of correspondences) can be of great help in the discovery of the truth, but how about the reverse? Can it also help us in the discovery of error? When we have power to discover error we are then aided through the process of elimination as mentioned earlier. "Let us pick a popular belief and see how it lines up with the Law of Correspondences. The Second Coming of Christ is a good one. "Many believe that in the end times (which is supposed to be about now) the world will become very wicked. "To protect the righteous God will rapture them into heaven completely off the earth. "Christ will come back in his wrath. He will appear in the sky visible to every person on earth having great armies of angels and send down fire to consume all who have not confessed a particular scripted belief in God and Christ. Afterwards the raptured earthlings will float down to the earth and Christ will turn it into a paradise that these righteous born againers will inherit for eternity "Now let us apply the Law of Correspondences to this belief. Does it fit? Why not?" James made a good point on this - that the standard version of the second Coming implies some type of instant perfection of imperfect beings into some static condition for all eternity. Now all things are ultimately possible and there will be times when some unusual events may occur that are unlike anything else in memory, but even these things will have correspondences somewhere along the line. Nevertheless, when we see someone making a prediction that has no representation in history there will be over a 99% chance that the prediction is either wrong or misunderstood. There are several things about the standard belief of the Coming of Christ that has no correspondence in history. (1) First the idea that he will appear in the sky and light it up for the whole world to see, apparently both sides of the globe. The scriptures indicating such an event is subject to several more practical interpretations, but beyond this, such an occurrence has no correspondence in either recorded or even mythological history. (2) The prediction that he will burn all those as stubble who do not bow down and worship him. This does not correspond to anything in scripture or recorded history. The Spirit of God always promotes free will and to threaten those who do not bow the knee with execution by fire does not allow much for free will for those who are believing of such words. (3) The idea that a group of very flawed emotionally based people who presently do not even get along with one another will be transformed into a heavenly kingdom where all will love one another has no correspondence anywhere. There's a lot of truth in the maxim that a leopard dos not change its spots. If a person is irritating and selfish before he makes a declaration of faith the chances are that these characteristics will remain after such declaration until he naturally works them out of his system over a period of time. Neither Jesus or God showing up in person will change a selfish unloving person into an angel. Obviously this idea of instant transformation into perfection has no correspondence anywhere. (4) Those who proclaim Jesus as Lord will be raptured up into heaven only leaving behind those who do not believe as they do. There is no accepted historical writing about anything close to this happening in history. However there are legends and some scriptures that give evidence that some type of mass translation has happened, but even here this happened as enlightened people gathered into one location and perfected their society. Even in the scriptures it appears that God uses people because of what is in their heart or what they have demonstrated in their actions. He gives very little credit for merely proclaiming belief. Such people who only prayed and had faith were the greatest enemies of Jesus 2000 years ago. Thus there seems to be no correspondence that applies to this idea. Susan made a statement that is a good guide in looking for the real fulfillment of prophecy: "Everything works out so normally that most people miss what is actually going on." Can you imagine the Christ coming and living among us here on the earth for 30 or 40 years and the ultra religious people still looking for him to come in the skies? This is entirely possible. Now let us look at some New Age beliefs and see how they fit. (1) Many are predicting drastic earth changes. (2) Many are predicting a visit from space aliens who will rapture us similar to the Christian belief about the coming of Christ. (3) Many are predicting a shift into a 5th, 6th or some other dimension which will transform all human life. Question: How do these beliefs fit in with the Law of Correspondences? Copyright 2000 By J.J. Dewey All Rights Reserved Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12920 From: (Jean) Subject: Re: Digest No. 2000-03-07 of The Keys of Knowledge List My prayers go out for Viggi, may the light surround you and keep you my friend. Mark, that was a beautiful thing to do reciting and translating it into Icelandic. :) Love to all, Jean My included homepage: http://community.webtv.net/Timber-roo/TheSandsOfTime Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12921 From: Mark D Williams Subject: SONG Actually Viggi was responsible for sending a copy of that translation to me. As a reminder for some and for others' information, I am collecting translations of the Song of the 144,000. We currently have 11 translations available at the xoom archives and are looking for more. http://members.xoom.com/keysarchive/song.html So if any other Keysters are multilingual and would like to send a version of the song in a language not yet available, please do. Thanks. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12922 From: (Rick Audette) Subject: Re: Discovering With Correspondence "Now let us look at some New Age beliefs and see how they fit. Question: How do these beliefs fit in with the Law of Correspondences? "(1) Many are predicting drastic earth changes." Been there done that. Mankind has survived many such changes, in the past. The most recent was the drastic climate changes of the ice age, some 10,000 years ago. In places it got cold so fast that animals froze solid, with their last meal still undigested. And yet mankind was not wiped out. Granted, some large numbers were wiped out, but many knew of the changes in advance and made preparations. Our current science is quite able to calculate the possible dangers and safety measures, without any help from spirits or aliens. "(2) Many are predicting a visit from space aliens who will rapture us similar to the Christian belief about the coming of Christ." This too has it's correspondence in history. Change a few words and you have, a visit from European Christians, who colonize the whole world, with promises to save the indigenous populations from their ignorant ways, while enslaving and killing them. None of that for me, thanks. I'm sticking with the Prime Directive. "(3) Many are predicting a shift into a 5th, 6th or some other dimension which will transform all human life." We already exist in all the dimensions. How can someone give me what I already have? Rick Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12923 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: Re: Real Karma: Christ's return Keith: Somehow these writings have been misinterpreted to mean that Karma can be dispersed with by simply adopting love as an idea and not as an active ingredient that requires action on the part of the individual. Judes: I think you have hit on a 'truth' that is very subtle and many on spiritual paths are deluded into believing that they understand ..but really may not. It is possible[ to me] that Jesu as the Christ may not even present himself to spiritual groups at all..as most all miss the mark in the simplicity of what you said above. Due to the misunderstanding that understanding love, or speaking about love, relishing the thought of love, or even being in a state of lovingness..is the simple act of precipitating love in to every act/deed. I feel that the act of self-initiating oneself by taking initiating actions is important on the path of a disciple seeking. Even if such actions are misinterpreted by fellow seekers as being self-glorifying..one must proceed the best they can. The couch-potato comfort of being a philosophic seeker can be self-deluding in that, although, one's thoughts and mind are reaching high levels..one's life is too sheltered and most have become sedentary in their actions..which is not just talking about love incessantly[as some new-agers do]. Of course, being anonymous with one's actions ...so that self-glorification is not the end result is the most ideal..one must not be hesitant to take actions of an initiatory status..out of fear of not having humility. This is subtle, Keith, and even hard to explain,,so thanks for having the guts to bring it up and X..for seeing the delusions associated with it. So the Christ..in my opinion, will present himself to those with the purest of heart and intentions..and not spiritual groups or sects as a whole. So..it will be about individuals..and not a 'set of beliefs' or those collected within a 'set of beliefs'. Judes Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12924 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: Re: Discovery with Correspondences I was a bit muddled on how to answer this..so waiting for JJ's reply..but then Rick's post and the confidence with which he gave his answer..clarified and gave me insight that all his answers sounded pretty 'pat'..or aligned with my thinking. I particularly liked the comparison of the 'aliens' saving us comments likened unto the European Christians. We know that we are clandestinely being visited by 'space aliens' and always have been..but if they make their presence known..that this is not necessary for the unfoldment of mankind unto its intended glory and could actual curtail that unfoldment..due to their intervention; because many will think that we need a helping hand..when we may not. So..I will not be very open to them..as I prefer doing it by ourselves [with the help of the Brotherhood-human hierarchy]..and feel that mankind is ready to make the leap to adulthood without intervention. As far as the earth changes scenario..I am a bit muddled still..as the works of Velikovsky..support physical evidence within the historical geological records that abrupt earth and climatic changes did indeed occur. So...I do not know the answers..just that I choose to not live in fear of it..or even fear of death as much as I can; because witnessing the reincarnation of my sister into my baby proves to me that life and love are eternal..and so I choose to trust that above fear or things that I cannot control. I feel that the other Brotherhood was over-emphasizing this..either out of deception or exaggeration to possibly hasten its occurrence by mind-creation. But..basically, waiting for JJ and others responses. Judes Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12925 From: "John Wayne Kline" Subject: (OT) NEW FORUM ADDRESS The Spiritual Art of Becoming Forum has been moved to http://nearorfar.net/sptforum_toc.htm and is now inside the NearOrFar Network. This is the business opportunity I presented some time ago. I decided to do it on my own. I guarantee it to be bug free until you find one. LOL It's a work in progress, that takes all my time every day. We're about ready to start putting businesses in - that will start next week You can find the first version at www.nearorfar.net The whole concept of the business is simple. The WWW is vast, but what does a small businessman in Littletown USA care about advertising to the world when all of their business comes from within a thirty mile radius. We simply provide a complete web service on a T3 line, and put everyone in the community in one Web Site. It's a simple but effective concept. There is a high profit potential with the setup we're using. A person doesn't even have to know anything about Web Sites to do this business. We set up everything for your area. You send us the pics and info, and your customer has a site within a week. The profit is split 50/50 on the sales. This doesn't include Web Site creation. That is at extra cost. If you can sell it is the easiest way to make money I've ever found. If your interested email me at jkline@usmo.com I have a ton more information to put in this site before next week, and plenty of glitches to work out so don't be to critical. The one thing I haven't figured out yet is how to convert it into other languages, but I'm working on it. Your Friend, John Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12926 From: "Rapter" Subject: Discovering through Correspondence Before Edison invented the light bulb there was nothing in recorded or mythological history that corresponded to this event. The detonation of the atomic bomb has no correspondence to anything in recorded history that I know of. Christian fundamentalists do not believe that when God raptures them into a new life with Christ they will exist in some sort of perfect stasis. If you read Hal Lindsey and a few others of that ilk they describe a raptured existence which continues expanding forever. Their learning has just begun at this point. They describe a new life immortal with Christ as co-heirs or Sons of Christ, serving God the Father in capacities undreamed of. Having just read the above you may suspect me of being a closet Christian Fundamentalist. I am as far away from this viewpoint as one can imagine. Nevertheless, I get a bit tired of occasionally reading things about them on this list which puts words in their mouths which I have never read or heard myself. I find it quite possible for God to manifest himself to the world by lighting up the horizon from one end of the earth to another. I do not particularly believe that this will happen. Although I do not limit God's actions to just correspondences in the past. There are many correspondences in history where the wicked are singled out and destroyed. Noah and the story of the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah and the angel of death passing over Pharoah's Egypt. In all cases God acts to destroy the wicked and save a remnant. Therefore, I do not find it improbable that God will once again destroy the wicked in order to save the just. I do not believe that this is in the cards as many fundamentalist do. But with God you can never be so sure. Remember, he is quick to anger! I have met a number of Christian Fundamentalists who are not emotionally flawed. Although I will admit to having met a few who are! The definition of transformed indicates a changed state of being, therefore when these believers (fundamentalists) are translated into the Kingdom of God they will not be the same disagreeable individuals they were in their fallen mortal bodies. They will possess immortal light bodies. I have witnessed a few examples in my life of completely wicked and selfish individuals being changed through some sort of spiritual experience. If this can happen in the physical I see no reason why it cannot happen in the spirit. I recall a thief being on the cross beside Christ who proclaimed a belief that Jesus indeed was the Christ. Jesus responded by assuring him that he would enter the Kingdom of God with him (Jesus) that very day. I recall an angel speaking to the jailer of an apostle who had asked the angel what he should do. The angel said believe in the Christ. Now if there were any other requirements, then this angel did the poor jailer a terrible this service. I am not taking issue with the law of correspondence as a tool to unearth truth. I am taking issue with the way it has been applied to stereotype Christian Fundamentalists. Keith Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12927 From: J J Dewey Subject: Response to Keith Not many posts today. Hope I'm not putting you to sleep out there. There few posts we have had have been interesting. Keith does not post very often but when he does, he usually says something of interest. First, I will quote a post that I agree with: "I believe that two new age authors (Agartha/Mentor and Jane Roberts/Seth.) wrote about Karma being transmuted by the giving of love through the active energy of the heart centre. These authors did not say that Karma was lessened by this action, but only that Karma was paid back in a heightened or quickened manner. Somehow these writings have been misinterpreted to mean that Karma can be dispersed with by simply adopting love as an idea and not as an active ingredient that requires action on the part of the individual." JJ This is indeed a true principle he mentions here. There are times that a person may accumulate tremendous Karma, such as being responsible for many deaths. Instead of coming back and giving his life ten times for ten lives he may pay the whole thing off in one life through loving service where he saves the lives of ten people, either physically of spiritually. If you take out a loan at a bank for $100,000 when your income is at $30,000 a year, it may be a significant struggle to pay it off. But if you work within the laws of prosperity and triple your income then you can triple the amount of payment that you make and pay off the loan much sooner than expected. The effect of the $100,000 was not reduced but the capacity to pay the debt was increased. Then Keith responded to my presentation of using correspondences in discovering the most probable truth about the return of Christ. One of the things I talked about was the idea that a prophecy is likely to fail if it has no correspondence in history. To this Keith says: "Before Edison invented the light bulb there was nothing in recorded or mythological history that corresponded to this event. The detonation of the atomic bomb has no correspondence to anything in recorded history that I know of." JJ But there is a correspondence to this my friend. The concept of inventing is not a new thing. There are thousands of new patents filed each year. There have been new inventions in the past, new inventions are being developed right and many new and unheard of inventions are yet to come. When a new and usable invention comes into reality the principles that make them work will always have correspondences to working principles to past inventions and/or the great science that is observed in nature. The atomic bomb has many correspondences and we have talked about many of these in the past Niels Bohr, whose work laid the foundation for the bomb, got a lot of his inspiration by contemplating the correspondence between a solar system and an atom. Edison saw that lightening lit up the night sky and felt that he could create a smaller light that could harness that electricity on a lesser level. Keith continues: "Christian fundamentalists do not believe that when God raptures them into a new life with Christ they will exist in some sort of perfect stasis." JJ I have talked to hundreds, perhaps thousands of them in my lifetime and each one that I have talked to seems to say the same thing which is this. When they are with Christ or in heaven each individual will be perfect in character, happiness and bliss. They tell me that God will transform their imperfect character into a new person in Christ that will not be able to sin any more. When I ask them about any additional progress they will make when they are with Christ they have no answer except that maybe they'll be doing something exciting, but they can't say what that will be. I am told again and again that heaven will be a great place because of things we cannot understand. Keith "If you read Hal Lindsey and a few others of that ilk they describe a raptured existence which continues expanding forever. Their learning has just begun at this point. They describe a new life immortal with Christ as co-heirs or Sons of Christ, serving God the Father in capacities undreamed of." JJ I have read Hal Lindsey and many others and do not remember them talking about any type of eternal progression as the Mormons teach. Most of them will criticize the Mormons for the idea that additional progress can be made in heaven when you are already living in a perfect state. Lindsey is more intelligent than most, but I cannot think of even one of his predictions from using the Bible which has come true. I can think of quite a few that have not. For instance he was expecting the end of the world to arrive some time ago. He has to keep rewriting his books to make then fit into the current time frame. I would bet that Sterling is a fan of this guy for some of his teachings of the end of things seem to follow his teachings. Keith "Having just read the above you may suspect me of being a closet Christian Fundamentalist. I am as far away from this viewpoint as one can imagine. Nevertheless, I get a bit tired of occasionally reading things about them on this list which puts words in their mouths which I have never read or heard myself." JJ You certainly have not sounded like one so far. Most of your postings have been quite logical. As far as my putting words in their mouth I do not believe I have done this. I am very familiar with the beliefs of many religions and if I have stated a belief of a certain group I am sure I can back up that which I have stated. If you wish to quote me on any statement I have made I would be happy to explain why I believe it to be accurate. I get a similar criticism from new agers for I attempt to point out illusions on both the left and the right. Keith "I find it quite possible for God to manifest himself to the world by lighting up the horizon from one end of the earth to another. I do not particularly believe that this will happen. Although I do not limit God's actions to just correspondences in the past." JJ I did not say that such an event was impossible but that it was highly improbably based on the Law of Correspondences. In addition to this many believe that at this event the wicked will be destroyed by fire. This idea of impulsively destroying the wicked by fire does not harmonize with the words of Jesus in the Bible. Luke 9:51 And it came to pass, when the time was come that he should be received up, he steadfastly set his face to go to Jerusalem, Luke 9:52 And sent messengers before his face: and they went, and entered into a village of the Samaritans, to make ready for him. Luke 9:53 And they did not receive him, because his face was as though he would go to Jerusalem. Luke 9:54 And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did? Luke 9:55 But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. Luke 9:56 For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them. And they went to another village. Here the disciples were angry because a village rejected then so they petitioned Jesus to use his power to bring down fire from heaven and consume these rebellious one. To this idea it is written: "But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them." Even so, many are expecting Jesus to show up and do that which he condemned in his last visit - such people will be disappointed. He has no more desire to zap the unbelievers now then he did 2000 years ago. I know a number of religious zealots who confess that they cannot wait for God to show up and destroy the wicked by fire, but as Jesus said they know not what manner of spirit they are. Keith "There are many correspondences in history where the wicked are singled out and destroyed. Noah and the story of the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah and the angel of death passing over Pharaoh's Egypt. In all cases God acts to destroy the wicked and save a remnant. Therefore, I do not find it improbable that God will once again destroy the wicked in order to save the just. I do not believe that this is in the cards as many fundamentalist do. But with God you can never be so sure. Remember, he is quick to anger!" JJ Let's look at the past two hundred years where we have an accurate record. The most notable destruction of a people in this period was Hitler's attempt to destroy the Jewish race. In addition we have had many wars, including two world wars. There have been many famines and natural disasters and in each instance we look at those who suffered and died on the average were not particularly good or evil, but just average folks trying to get on in the world. All destruction comes through the law of cause and effect and God himself must wield this law if he is to wreck havoc on the souls of men. We have to go back to Bible times to find the destruction of a people who were identified as "the wicked." But even here there is no correspondence to the tribulation expected by the fundamentalists. There is nothing in the Bible about a people being raptured leaving those who remain to be destroyed. Let us take the time of Moses. If Pharaoh would have let the slaves go free there would have been no destruction at all. The plagues increased in severity only because Egypt refused to free the Israelites. Finally, when they were freed the Pharaoh and his armies pursued the Israelites to destroy them. The final miracle of drowning the armies of Egypt in the Red Sea was an act of self defense. Now let us take the standard Christian belief in the end of times. It could be a day like today. Suddenly millions of Christians are just missing because they have been raptured into heaven. Those who remain behind are now at the mercy of an antichrist that will make Hitler look like Snow White. For three and a half years he will rule the world with a reign of terror then at the end of this period all who remain will be destroyed by fire. There are several versions of what happens next but most believe that Jesus and the raptured ones will come back to earth and live here as kings for a thousand years. Now in the Bible times when destruction was on the horizon the people in danger were warned by a prophet who foresaw the future and whose predictions actually came true. Those who are considered the wicked today by the fundamentalists have only been warned by many people who have never made an accurate prophesy and have shown no reason why they should be believed. Moses at least turned a staff into a snake, Elijah made fire come down from heaven, Jesus rose from the dead and so on. Are the "wicked' of today justly warned when their next door neighbor just parrots to him mantras that he heard at church that has never been tested in any way? If a people were to be destroyed by the coming of the Lord he would warn them in a way so they would be left without excuse, just as Pharaoh and his armies were without excuse and deserved the fate the reaped. If God is indeed just then a person destroyed by God for his evil ways would have to confess that he deserved such a fate. I know there are millions of people judged by fundamentalists as deserving of the fire who would certainly question the justice of God if they were destroyed merely because they did not accept the right version of Jesus. One must also realize that many of the rapture believers think that many believers in Christ will be destroyed because they accept the wrong version of Jesus. These include the Mormons, Seventh Day Adventists, Jehovah Witnesses, New Agers and many others. Keith "I have met a number of Christian Fundamentalists who are not emotionally flawed. Although I will admit to having met a few who are!" JJ I was speaking of a principle here that applies to all people. At least 99% of us have emotional flaws. Keith "The definition of transformed indicates a changed state of being, therefore when these believers (fundamentalists) are translated into the Kingdom of God they will not be the same disagreeable individuals they were in their fallen mortal bodies. They will possess immortal light bodies." JJ There is no correspondence to any alteration in body changing a person from one who is irritating as hell to one who is heavenly nice. Keith "I have witnessed a few examples in my life of completely wicked and selfish individuals being changed through some sort of spiritual experience. If this can happen in the physical I see no reason why it cannot happen in the spirit." JJ I have seen a lot of people who have claimed to have made this change, but I have never witnessed anything close to it. A lot of people have made a change of habit, career, or belief system, but when I have seen this happen I have noticed very little change in the fundamental character. For instance, I have never seen a selfish person become unselfish in a short period of time. The best I have seen here is maybe a slight change over 20-30 years. Keith: "I recall a thief being on the cross beside Christ who proclaimed a belief that Jesus indeed was the Christ. Jesus responded by assuring him that he would enter the Kingdom of God with him (Jesus) that very day." JJ There's no evidence that the thief repented or made any change. He did not even profess any belief. Instead he merely asked Jesus to remember him. Maybe the guy was as thief to feed his family, or maybe he was even a hero like Robin Hood. We do not know the details here, but a person does not have to be perfect to enter the paradise of God. Most of the inhabitants there stole something when they were upon the earth and will make amends in a future life. Keith: "I am not taking issue with the law of correspondence as a tool to unearth truth. I am taking issue with the way it has been applied to stereotype Christian Fundamentalists." JJ I'm not talking about stereotypes of people, but attempting to examine various belief systems using the Law of Correspondences. Any belief, even one imagined, is suitable fodder for the test of this law. Question: Many people new age and old age believe that the people on this planet at this present time are the most evil bunch in history. Do you believe this to be true? Is the righteousness of the people on this planet increasing or decreasing? Copyright 2000 By J.J. Dewey All Rights Reserved Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12928 From: (Rick Audette) Subject: Re: Discovering through Correspondence Keith said, "The detonation of the atomic bomb has no correspondence to anything in recorded history that I know of." Rick says, Keep reading then, Keith. There are written records of a nuclear war, which happened before the days of Adam and Eve. These records are in Sanskrit and claim themselves to be transcribed from still earlier texts. I don't have the exact URL bookmarked on this computer, but you can locate an English translation of parts of it by doing a web search for "Rishi Cities". The text tells of a war, between Atlantis and the Rama empire (present day Pakistan), in which Atlantis nuked the major cities of the Rama empire. They described the bomb as containing all the power of "heaven" in a single lightening bolt and even told of the shape of the mushroom cloud. In the early 1950's archeologists unearthed some of these cities. They found countless radioactive skeletons, laying in the streets and pottery that had been melted into glass. Rick Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12929 From: Margaret Leach Subject: Re: Response to Keith J J Dewey wrote: "Question: Many people new age and old age believe that the people on this planet at this present time are the most evil bunch in history. Do you believe this to be true? Is the righteousness of the people on this planet increasing or decreasing?" I believe the light is getting lighter and the dark is getting darker. As the general vibratory rate (of our planet) rises, the intensity of whatever we believe/do becomes greater. Fence sitting is becoming harder and harder. Love and Light, Margaret Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12930 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: Re: Discovery with Correspondences Rick: "The text tells of a war, between Atlantis and the Rama empire (present day Pakistan), in which Atlantis nuked the major cities of the Rama empire" Judes: fascinating! Thanks for sharing and giving us the lead of Rishi to search on. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12931 From: Brian Weis Subject: Re: Discovery with Correspondences (Rishi) Dogpile (www.dogpile.com) and google (www.google.com) seem to be the best places to do this particular search. ~B. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12932 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: JJ's Question JJ: Many people new age and old age believe that the people on this planet at this present time are the most evil bunch in history. Do you believe this to be true? Is the righteousness of the people on this planet increasing or decreasing? Judes: I think that we as a planet and race are maintaining a status quo..which has been the stasis for some time now...last 2000 years. There have been many 'great' ones throughout history which have left their mark..as Jesu did..but they, these individuals, have had to stand against the mainstream paradigms and many have lost their lives for presenting new ideas or progressive thought. As examples..Galileo, Joseph Smith, Anwar Sadat, Thomas Moore, etc.. So..it has been hard for individuals to stand up against the conformity and comfort of following the dictates of a controlled society or controlled indoctrinated religious beliefs. Another example is the Baba teachings that you spoke of, JJ, that have been persecuted in the East. I do feel that we are approaching a new paradigm, wherein, a major shift may be about to occur within many hearts instead of just particular individuals. This shift...taking place..more on an en masse scale could be the 100th monkey principle that will turn the tide to a great leap in consciousness that will affect real change globally. I feel that the teachings from "the Immortal" and groups such as this list are part of engendering that paradigm shift. Love: Judes Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12933 From: (Rick Audette) Subject: Re: Response to Keith "Question: Many people new age and old age believe that the people on this planet at this present time are the most evil bunch in history. Do you believe this to be true? Is the righteousness of the people on this planet increasing or decreasing?" I think the number of people that are on one side or the other of the dividing line, between good and evil, probably stays about the same, with some minor fluctuations, but the general quality of Righteousness has been increasing. Rick Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12934 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: Response to Keith Loving Greetings, "Question: Many people new age and old age believe that the people on this planet at this present time are the most evil bunch in history. Do you believe this to be true? Is the righteousness of the people on this planet increasing or decreasing?" Rick: I think the number of people that are on one side or the other of the dividing line, between good and evil, probably stays about the same, with some minor fluctuations, but the general quality of Righteousness has been increasing. Zia: I would like to add to this thought... I agree with the numbers being about the same, yet as righteousness increases... as the pull for good increases, the counterbalance, the pull for evil will also increase. If we look simply at ourselves as we walk more and more in the light, love and power of God, we also seem to draw greater negativity or evil towards ourselves, since there is a balancing always operating. Just as the Brotherhood of Light desires greater light... then the opposite force will desire greater darkness to balance that force and strive to overcome the light, and to me that was seen in the times of Christ, and to all those great ones that sought to achieve over the past 2,000 or even 200 years. The other aspect that I see in the balancing act, is our own civilization, as a greater spiritual awareness and righteousness increases, so does the negativity within the civilization... thus our civilization seems to be degenerating as is witnessed now by our children killing children in the streets and in the schools. This is quite a prelude to the potential downfall of a civilization, as the dark forces operate in those so vulnerable. Yet we are in a time of greater and greater spiritual awareness and application. So as righteousness escalates in our life, that is right use of will, being God's Will in Action, we will see in duality the evil aspect escalating striving to overcome that growth... in a sense an intensification in both sides of the duality, thus the balance. As the Will for Good accomplishes, then the darker forces are also lifted lessening there power ultimately for evil, because consciousness, God's Will, and good have escalated to a higher level, and thus all of life is lifted, even the evil (being lessened by degrees) in the balancing act. Loving servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12935 Subject: Re: Response to Keith From: "* Zia" Loving greetings, JJ This is indeed a true principle he mentions here. There are times that a person may accumulate tremendous Karma, such as being responsible for many deaths. Instead of coming back and giving his life ten times for ten lives he may pay the whole thing off in one life through loving service where he saves the lives of ten people, either physically of spiritually. Zia: This is quite an important aspect of Karma that often is overlooked. And to consider that 'healing others' as a service does not exist in many other kingdoms since each takes full responsibility for themselves, and is beyond harm to others, there is no need of healing being directed to another, or a balance of payment so to speak. So this aspect of healing to balance karma is very much isolated as a balance and completion aspect to this planet and perhaps a few others, but certainly not an aspect of our total universe as I understand it. So perhaps what got confused for the new age community is that the master that is in total 'service' being a servant of God, and thus supposedly without incurring Karma, got confused in that without a nature to do harm, and a purpose of God's Will in Action, and the recognition of serving that Will (servant of God), incurs only what we would consider as GOOD KARMA, and thus there is no negative karma to be paid off or balanced. So many new age thoughts or 'understandings' then get 'shortened' to be something like a master having no karma (because of no debts so to speak)... perhaps a master simply does not incur negative karma... and this understood changes everything... what say you JJ?? Loving servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12936 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: Real Karma: Zia Zia: So many new age thoughts or 'understandings' then get 'shortened' to be something like a master having no karma (because of no debts so to speak)... perhaps a master simply does not incur negative karma... and this understood changes everything... what say you JJ?? Judes: Right, Zia..I agree and think Master's know how to not incur negative karma..and their actions are powerful enough to effect many planes and lives positively; so that their past karma is quickly dispelled. Then..it was misconstrued that karma was not relevant to a Master level..but it really is in that they know how to utilize the laws for greater advancement and causes. Something like that..anyway. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12937 From: Brian Weis Subject: Re: Discovery with Correspondences (Rishi) Just so everyone knows, dogpile and google are real, honest-to-goodness search engines. I've received a few personal emails congratulating me on my wit, but it's no joke this time, folks! : ) Rick: "The text tells of a war, between Atlantis and the Rama empire (present day Pakistan), in which Atlantis nuked the major cities of the Rama empire "Dogpile (www.dogpile.com) and google (www.google.com) seem to be the best places to do this particular search." Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12938 From: Samu Karlsson Subject: Re: Discovery with Correspondences (Rishi) I've no idea how people could ever come to the conclusion that you were *not* being serious, buddy ;D Almost dead-pan, Samu :) chasethedogstarovertheseahomewheremytrueloveiswaitingformeropethesouthwind Samu Karlsson samu3@dlc.fi samu.karlsson@norpe.fi http://www.dlc.fi/~samu3 "Just remember not to forget and you'll be fine... but you already know this, don't you?" canvasthestarsharnessthemoonlightsoshecansafelygoroundthecapehorntovalparaiso Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12939 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: Discovering With Correspondence "J J Dewey" writes: "I liked Brian's comment about the word MAGI being incorporated into imagine. It is not a coincidence that we have many hidden messages within there words we use - more than even the enlightened realize." Craig: Me too! Our language is less mysterious than we think. The derivation of words mostly holds ancient meaning, even through translation. When surprised, it is usually we who are uneducated about our own language. JJ: "Now let us look at some New Age beliefs and see how they fit. (1) Many are predicting drastic earth changes. (2) Many are predicting a visit from space aliens who will rapture us similar to the Christian belief about the coming of Christ. (3) Many are predicting a shift into a 5th, 6th or some other dimension which will transform all human life. "Question: How do these beliefs fit in with the Law of Correspondences?" DRASTIC EARTH CHANGES - There is nothing new here. The myopia of modern man certainly makes it news to those who refuse to learn about their planet's history. Earth has been involved in repeated catastrophic changes throughout its history. Are we ripe for more changes? The inherent problem with statistics, which suggests we are ripe for catastrophic change, is that it is a science of probabilities, and is wholly incapable of dealing with "when." It is not important to us what is coming in the way of change so much, as it is important how we deal with the change once it gets here. The fine print, however, is that those who have a concept of how drastic the change "may" be, will not be going crazy as the changes are causing others to flip out, and experience traumatic shock. We have experienced super-novas in the skies in the last 15 years which represent the largest scale change we are aware of, in the world of form. The laws of correspondence leave no doubt that this is a dynamic universe and that we can expect our world of form to change. JJ: (2) Many are predicting a visit from space aliens who will rapture us similar to the Christian belief about the coming of Christ. Craig: I am a space alien and I'll let you know when we begin boarding. Speaking of rapture, does anyone know when the "molecular relationship" goes through its symbolic adolescent stage of experimenting with psychoactive substances? I can't wait! JJ: (3) Many are predicting a shift into a 5th, 6th or some other dimension which will transform all human life. Craig: One dimension at a time, please! Love, Craig All Rights Continue To Be Reserved By He Whose Right It Is. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-07/12940 From: Rick Audette Subject: Re: Discovery with Correspondences Here's one place to read about ancient aircraft and nuclear war. http://www.veling.nl/anne/templars/ancientaircraft_nf.html below are 2 paragraphs from that page: Just because we haven't read everything written about history, doesn't mean it didn't happen or get written about. These are written histories, written many thousands of years before the Adam and Eve we find in the Bible. Rick +++++++++++++++++++++ The ancient Mahabharata, one of the sources on Vimanas, goes on to tell the awesome destructiveness of the war: "...(the weapon was) a single projectile charged with all the power of the Universe. An incandescent column of smoke and flame as bright as the thousand suns rose in all its splendour... An iron thunderbolt, a gigantic messenger of death, which reduced to ashes the entire race of the Vrishnis and the Andhakas.... the corpses were so burned as to be unrecognizable. The hair and nails fell out; pottery broke without apparent cause, and the birds turned white.... after a few hours all foodstuffs were infected.... to escape from this fire, the soldiers threw themselves in streams to wash themselves and their equipment..." It would seem that the Mahabharata is describing an atomic war! References like this one are not isolated; but battles, using a fantastic array of weapons and aerial vehicles are common in all the epic Indian books. One even describes a Vimana-Vailix battle on the Moon! The above section very accurately describes what an atomic explosion would look like and the effects of the radioactivity on the population. Jumping into water is the only respite. When the Rishi City of Mohenjodaro was excavated by archaeologists in the last century, they found skeletons just lying in the streets, some of them holding hands, as if some great doom had suddenly overtaken them. These skeletons are among the most radioactive ever found, on a par with those found at Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Ancient cities whose brick and stonewalls have literally been vitrified, that is-fused together, can be found in India, Ireland, Scotland, France, Turkey and other places. There is no logical explanation for the vitrification of stone forts and cities, except from an atomic blast. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12941 From: "Glenys Lowery" Subject: Re: Response to Keith From: "J J Dewey" : "Question: Many people new age and old age believe that the people on this planet at this present time are the most evil bunch in history. Do you believe this to be true? Is the righteousness of the people on this planet increasing or decreasing?" I think I must be one of the minority who thinks that people are getting better. A couple of weeks ago I was telling the Synthesis Group about the return of the Christ and a few of them said they didn't believe it would take place because, in their view, we weren't 'good enough'. In reply, I asked them whether they thought the world was a better place 2000 years ago when the Christ overshadowed Jesus. They didn't have an answer. It was clear then that the world was not ready to manifest the Kingdom of God in any way that could be described as all encompassing and the work of the Christ was to prepare men's hearts for his eventual return and the manifestation of the Kingdom by stimulating the Christ principle within them. Once this principle was sufficiently instilled in the hearts of enough people, then Christ could return to complete His work. Those who believe that the return of the Christ is imminent believe that this has been achieved. One only has to look at recent history and the growth of Christ consciousness in people all over the world to see that there has been a significant shift during the last 2000 years and particularly during the last century. People are more intelligent and intuitive and are questioning the power of the Beast, if not yet overthrowing it. Many are adopting will-to-good and brotherhood of man philosophies and seeing that the good of the whole is more important than the good of the one. Old ideas are being shaken off as the new wineskins are being prepared and men everywhere are doing their best to adopt right relationships, not only on a personal level but on international and world platforms eg the birth of the United Nations (yes, I know it has lots of faults but the philosophy behind it is sound). People are starting to break free from the chains of materialism and self service and desire a better way, knowing that the old paradigms have failed miserably. As they grow in knowledge, people are becoming tired of repeating the same old mistakes and want to break free from the destructive and repetitive cycles that have dominated world history. People everywhere are looking for a better way with hearts full of expectation and they are trying, tentatively at times, to experiment with policies and practices that improve the lot of mankind. What better time for God, in His mercy, to send the Christ to 'save' us once again. The ground is fertile, mankind has come of age. The seeds of righteousness have taken root and will triumph. Love Glenys -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Morality is a human creation -- the Universe does not judge Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12942 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: Discovering through Correspondence Rick & Keith, Zecharia Sitchen's books, which are Sumerian interpretations, lead one to believe that the atom had been harnessed 5,000 years ago. Love, Craig Keith said, "The detonation of the atomic bomb has no correspondence to anything in recorded history that I know of." Rick says, "Keep reading then, Keith. There are written records of a nuclear war, which happened before the days of Adam and Eve. These records are in Sanskrit and claim themselves to be transcribed from still earlier texts." Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-08/12943 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: Response to Keith I agree with Margaret. For many years I have grown to believe that the polarization between increasing and decreasing (perceived) righteousness was growing. Correspondences would indicate to me that a balance must be maintained within this realm or else the gain would have to be turned up, and then we would be talking about a major dimensional/awareness shift. It hasn't happened yet as far as I can tell, except in the persons of the extreme end of one of the polarizations. And they are balanced out by those who are progressing in the other direction. Love, Craig "Religion is for people who are afraid to go to hell. And those who say it can't be done... are usually interrupted by others who are doing it." "Margaret Leach" writes: "I believe the light is getting lighter and the dark is getting darker. As the general vibratory rate (of our planet) rises, the intensity of whatever we believe/do becomes greater. Fence sitting is becoming harder and harder." Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12944 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: [OT] Phylis Diller Sorry for such a drastic change of subject, but can any of you trivia buffs remember what Phylis Diller's husband's name was? Love, Craig Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12945 From: Samu Karlsson Subject: Re: [OT] Phylis Diller Sure sure, go to http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/biography/Diller.html :) Btw, Mark's KSTB Forum is excellent for this kind of stuff: http://network54.com/Hide/Forum/50816 Love, Samu _______________ Samu Karlsson eMail: samu3@dlc.fi http://www.dlc.fi/~samu3 Just remember not to forget and you?ll be fine... but you already know this, don?t you? Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12946 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Brigham Young Brigham Young, the second Mormon leader had many interesting things to say about the God each of us are: "When I speak to a congregation I know that I am speaking to the intelligence that is from above. This intelligence which is within you and me is from heaven. In gazing upon the intelligence reflected in the countenances of my fellow beings, I gaze upon the image of Him whom I worship -- the God I serve. I see His image and a certain amount of His intelligence there. I feel it within myself. My nature shrinks at the divinity we see in others. This is the cause of that timidity to which I have referred, which I experience when rising to address a congregation." (1870, JD13:171) "Furthermore, if men can understand and receive it, mankind are organized to receive intelligence until they become perfect in the sphere they are appointed to fill, which is far ahead of us at present. . . . It is the Deity within us that causes increase. Does this idea startle you? Are you ready to exclaim, 'What, the Supreme in us!' Yes, He is in every person upon the face of the earth. The elements that every individual is made of and lives in, possess the Godhead. This you cannot now understand, but you will hereafter." (1852, JD 1:93; see also 1856, JD 3:335) Love, Craig Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12947 From: xavier Subject: Re: Response to Keith "Glenys Lowery" writes: "I think I must be one of the minority who thinks that people are getting better. A couple of weeks ago I was telling the Synthesis Group about the return of the Christ and a few of them said they didn't believe it would take place because, in their view, we weren't 'good enough'. In reply, I asked them whether they thought the world was a better place 2000 years ago when the Christ overshadowed Jesus. They didn't have an answer." Yes, 2000 years ago, societies were barbaric as we can't even imagine. Life had no value at all. Only force could give right. Death came early in life, etc... Can anyone describe us what western societies were like at that time? If we compare with today, indeed we have a great opportunity for the second coming to be extraordinary. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12948 From: "Rapter" Subject: O.T. Phylis Diller I believe Phyllis' husband's name was 'Fang'. Keith Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12949 From: "Rapter" Subject: Response to Keith I knew my post would generate a good response! It is always fun to dust the cobwebs of once and awhile. Thanks to Rick and J.J for their excellent insights as always. To answer your question J.J. I believe mankind is no better today than they were 2000 years ago, or even 50,000 years ago. I think man is still indifferent to the suffering of his brothers, just as he has always been. There have always been those few who are lead by an inner truth, which motives them to make a difference. These few individuals continually make the difference between a slow plodding progress and/or no progress at all. Despite this, I am still optimistic that this coming age of Aquarius will speed are progress along at a quickened rate for a time. Keith Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12950 From: J J Dewey Subject: Things Getting Better Concerning Karma Zia writes "This is quite an important aspect of Karma that often is overlooked. And to consider that 'healing others' as a service does not exist in many other kingdoms since each takes full responsibility for themselves, and is beyond harm to others, there is no need of healing being directed to another, or a balance of payment so to speak. So this aspect of healing to balance karma is very much isolated as a balance and completion aspect to this planet and perhaps a few others, but certainly not an aspect of our total universe as I understand it." JJ Cause and effect reaches into all kingdoms in all spheres. Even a plant operates under this law but the dynamics of the law as it affects the lower kingdoms are much more subtle as far as karma goes. As far as we are concerned, karma as it affects the human kingdom is of prime importance from our point of view. Zia continues: "So perhaps what got confused for the new age community is that the master that is in total 'service' being a servant of God, and thus supposedly without incurring Karma, got confused in that without a nature to do harm, and a purpose of God's Will in Action, and the recognition of serving that Will (servant of God), incurs only what we would consider as GOOD KARMA, and thus there is no negative karma to be paid off or balanced. So many new age thoughts or 'understandings' then get 'shortened' to be something like a master having no karma (because of no debts so to speak)... perhaps a master simply does not incur negative karma... and this understood changes everything... what say you JJ??" JJ All lives, even Masters, have negative as well as positive karma. This statement may startle some, but first consider this. There cannot be a positive unless a negative is lurking in the background somewhere. "But," asks one, "haven't we learned here that a Master learns to work with the law of cause and effect so karma works in his favor?" Yes, I have indicated that, but one more thing needs to be considered. When one expands his consciousness and masters karma as it causes painful effects on the human kingdom so that it seems as if one is indeed a Master of producing good effects as we understand the idea - then a new problem is created. This expansion of consciousness that creates the Master also expands his ring-pass-not so new worlds of becoming appear before his eyes. With this comes new challenges and as he moves into these new vistas where he is a beginning student, and no longer the master, he again makes mistakes but on a higher level. These higher mistakes, which are not to be comprehended by the average seeker, create again both positive and negative karma. Let me quote again from what I believe to be the highest writings on the planet: DK through Alice A. Bailey. Here are some exerts that clearly tell us that lives above human have to deal with karma. These include lives as high up as the Ancient of Days (Sanat Kumara) and the Solar Logos and beyond. The whole question depends upon two things, which are the karma of the man, the planetary Logos, and the solar Logos, and the dominance of the spiritual indwelling entity over its vehicle. Types of Karma. We might here enumerate the different types of KARMA, even though we have not the time to enlarge upon the subject. A book by itself of vast proportions could not contain all that might be said. We should bear in mind that KARMA is imposed upon the ensouling entity through the medium of matter or of substance itself (which is coloured by it) and that this matter or substance is intelligent material composed of deva essence. Cosmic Karma-Imposed upon the solar Logos from outside of the system. Systemic Karma-The working out by the Logos of effects set in motion in previous Kalpas, and which influence His present type of Body. Planetary Karma-The individual karma of a Heavenly Man, which is just as different from that of another Heavenly Man, as is the karma of the different members of the human family. In connection with the karma of the solar Logos, the subject is even more abstract and incomprehensible. The relation of the fifth Hierarchy to a certain constellation has also a bearing upon this mystery. This is hidden in the karma of the solar Logos, and concerns His relationship to another solar Logos, and the interplay of force between them in a greater mahakalpa. This is the true "secret of the Dragon," and it was the dragon-influence or the "serpent energy" which caused the influx of manasic or mind energy into the solar system. Entangled closely with the karma of these two Entities, was that of the lesser cosmic Entity Who is the Life of our planet, the planetary Logos. It was this triple karma which brought in the "serpent religion" and the "Serpents or Dragons of Wisdom" in Lemurian days. The problem of humanity in respect to imperfection is complicated, not only by the fact that the seven informing vitalising Energies are "tainted with imperfection," but also by the fact that the Lord of the World is Himself, from the angle of a Solar Logos for instance, far from perfect; this is the reason why our planet, the Earth, is not a sacred planet. We are told that Sanat Kumara is the divine prisoner of this planet, held here until the "last weary pilgrim has found his way home." This is His heavy karma even whilst it is an expression of His desire and of His joy; the "weary pilgrims" are the atoms (human or otherwise) in His body, and they are tainted with imperfection because of His imperfections; their complete "healing" will set the term for His release. JJ If therefore lives such as the Solar Logos and beyond have to deal with karma then we might as well put the idea of escape from cause and effect out of our minds for at least several eternities. Actually this goes along well with our current topic. Today's Question: Many people, new age and old age, believe that the people on this planet at this present time are the most evil bunch in history. Do you believe this to be true? Is the righteousness of the people on this planet increasing or decreasing? I particularly liked Glenys's answer on this: "One only has to look at recent history and the growth of Christ consciousness in people all over the world to see that there has been a significant shift during the last 2000 years and particularly during the last century. People are more intelligent and intuitive and are questioning the power of the Beast, if not yet overthrowing it. Many are adopting will-to-good and brotherhood of man philosophies and seeing that the good of the whole is more important than the good of the one. Old ideas are being shaken off as the new wineskins are being prepared and men everywhere are doing their best to adopt right relationships, not only on a personal level but on international and world platforms eg the birth of the United Nations (yes, I know it has lots of faults but the philosophy behind it is sound). People are starting to break free from the chains of materialism and self service and desire a better way, knowing that the old paradigms have failed miserably. As they grow in knowledge, people are becoming tired of repeating the same old mistakes and want to break free from the destructive and repetitive cycles that have dominated world history. People everywhere are looking for a better way with hearts full of expectation and they are trying, tentatively at times, to experiment with policies and practices that improve the lot of mankind." JJ In my younger days when I used to attend church I heard the idea preached again and again that the world is more wicked than it has ever been in the history of the world. As evidence of this I was told to look around and witness the wars and rumors of wars and man's inhumanity to man. (Notice girls that the male is blamed for all the inhumanity?). I swallowed this idea without thinking about it until a time came that an alternative view was presented to me. This new idea was that the people on the earth are evolving and getting better as a whole and not worse. This immediately struck a chord with me and after hearing it I wondered why I had not considered it before. For just one comparison consider this. A couple thousand years ago it was national sport to throw Christian men women and children to the lions.. The crowds composed of former neighbors and friends of such Christians cheered the lions on as they tore their victims limb to limb. Now we give Spain a bad time for bullfighting, but imagine if they reinstituted this ancient spectacle? Why all the nations of the earth including he totalitarian regimes would be abhorred and protest with righteous indignation. Her in Idaho farmers made national headlines a few years ago when they killed jack rabbits that were causing them problems. Now they had been doing this for many years and no one complained, but when some journalist wrote a national article about it the whole nation began to look upon us as a bunch of animal hating hicks. Just a couple hundred years ago there was not this much outrage over killing a surf or a slave. Now people are becoming as sensitive to the life of a tree as they were the life of a human in the days of Jesus. We just mentioned that when karma is mastered on one level we then move up to a higher level where we have subtler karmas to work with. The same is applied to good and evil which is closely linked to cause and effect. One of the goals of the higher lives is to not only bring in the greater good of a new age, but to raise the standard of evil so that which was evil in days past (throwing people to lions for sport) becomes unthinkable and a lesser evil (killing jack rabbits) becomes the new definition of the bad behavior. As we are approaching the new age we tend to go overboard and in some ways we are too sensitive and too politically correct, but after the pendulum swings back and forth a few times we will reach a happy medium in judgment. Now we could spend many months discussing this Law of Correspondences which has been under discussion, but I believe we have covered it enough to give an idea as to its value in the principles of discovery. We will cover another post or two on it and move on to an entirely new topic, largely out of group need. Nevertheless, this law will come up again and again in these teachings. Even though there are more principles of discovery to cover I am impressed to move on to talk about the principles of good health and then finish this topic at a later time. A number of people on the list have health problems and my heart goes out to them. It is also of extreme importance that those of us seeking to serve, who presently have good health, maintain this vitality, for poor health is indeed a great handicap to many. We could spend years ion this subject, but the class goal at present is to cover the most important and useful information.. Wholeness (holiness) in health covers many areas including the physical, emotional mental and spiritual. Let us start with the physical and move up. What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health? Copyright 2000 By J.J. Dewey All Rights Reserved Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12951 From: "susan carter" Subject: Re: Things Getting Better J J Dewey wrote: "What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health?" Breathe fully and deeply. Listen to our bodies: sleeping when it needs it, exercising when it needs it, eating what it needs Surround ourselves with beautiful sounds, smells, sights and EN-JOY them For men, being married improves their health, according to science. I am guessing that for women it is not just the marital state that improves health, but the feeling of being loved. Susan (back after being gone all week and enjoying the posts this week) Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12952 From: Rob Subject: Re: Things Getting Better J J Dewey wrote: "What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health?" Yea! Proper diet, regular exercise, get enough sleep, and stay away from toxins (smoking, drugs, drinking, etc.) Rob Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12953 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: Things Getting Better Loving greetings, JJ asks: What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health? Zia: It is on the physical plane that we can access all planes, and through this access we are able to consciously maintain health in all aspects, physical, emotional, mental and spiritual. Because of our western busy lifestyle, and our 'love' of entertainment, I personally find that to develop good 'health' habits just like cleaning my body everyday... benefits me because of the natural routine that I impose, and also realizing that unless I have found a great love of it and am drawn to it like enjoying a great movie, my resistance would affect its outcome and benefits. Also whether it is eating a beautiful meal, meditating (focusing for me), working out at the gym, or writing responses to the Keys of Knowledge List :) combining as much as possible all aspects of physical, emotional, mental and spiritual exercises in each of these activities, keeps me more aware, balanced, and 'lively' in the activity using all faculties, thus exercising and maintaining health in all activities. I find I love the gym now, yet when I first went good grief I thought... saw my resistance... was immediately cluttered emotionally and chose to find great love and enjoyment at the gym. It is a great place to use our focusing abilities, 'seeing' the muscles we want to improve and exercise, 'seeing' our body 'shape' improvement... that to me is combining physical exercise with mental exercise, so that both get a work out... I have had some of my greatest insights while on that 'no not boring' treadmill!! What I see as important is because thought comes first... creative thought then its outpicturing, action, simple affirmations of radiant health and vitality, will automatically draw to me those things that ensure radiant health and vitality. Good food, as much as possible from the 'garden', sufficient sleep that is restful, and opportunities for exercise, activities that bring me laughter and enjoyment, thoughts that inspire and uplift me, and time with the highest within myself... God and All that Is... for in that quiet contemplation and its upliftment I am super-energized. In fact understanding the law of cause and effect... that to give healing to others... means I too am receiving the energy... and am healed and uplifted. Most important to radiant health and vitality when we have addressed the simple things of providing the necessities for the physical body including clean, fresh air breathed deeply regularly, warmth and protection to the body for one's climate etc... is our 'attitudes', for these more than anything else that I can see have a profound affect upon the body, both short and long term. So 'conscious' activity, awareness of thoughts, attitudes, and focused attention for desired results, and a great sense of 'gratitude' for one's life, and seeing the results and magnificent benefits of simple attitudes, and the love of life. I was given yesterday something so simple: 'When we receive gratitude from another, we want to give more'!! I had just 'opened to receive' in my focus, and I felt God's love of gratitude, for it seemed the 'perfect' state of mind, that would bring more and more 'benefits' such as health, wealth and happiness... and keep us operating at optimum fitness (the name of my gym!!). Perhaps equally important is 'finding pleasure' in the simplest of tasks, and being fully present in them. Then the exercise, the focus, the enjoyment, and the gratitude are in themselves exercising all levels of my being. Loving servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12954 From: xavier Subject: Re: Things Getting Better "What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health?" Physical exercise (like sports) Diet. Learn its rules and have a balanced diet. Breathing. (somewhat covered by first item) You can't live without it, but you can live badly with a lack of oxygen. Psychological approach is nice, but without a good supply of oxygen, pains don't go away, healing is difficult etc.. Sexuality. As a major physical expression, it has powerful effects on all bodily functions. But JJ, all these physical functions are heavily influenced by our emotions and thoughts. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12955 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: Health question: JJ's JJ: What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health? Judes: I am so glad you are getting into this area[Health]...as I am beginning to feel that it is time that I focused on this more in my life. I tend to neglect myself health-wise taking my vitality for granted and putting my business, baby, and other tasks before my own health..even though I know what that would entail and how really simple that would be. My ideas of 4 things would be: 1.) Curtail/stop health endangering habits or addictions. [i.e. smoking, over/under-eating, junk- foods, addiction to turmoil/stress..etc.] 2.) Physical exercise or breathing exercises [moderate..but not excessive like marathon running, etc.] 3.) Good eating habits..whole and real foods..at regular intervals..lots of liquids [teas/juices] and waters 4.) Healthy sleep routine..not burning the midnight oil excessively Sort of just the basic health routine..I am way off on all of these..so I need to start with basics. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12956 From: (Rick Audette) Subject: Re: Things Getting Better "What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health?" Probably the same as for any machine we use; 1) Good attitude (most important) 2) good fuel 3) good waist elimination 4) good use 1) Even in the hands of an unskilled mechanic, a machine, or vehicle will run better and longer if it is loved or liked by it's operator. Love your body. 2) Machines will often run on a variety of energy sources or sources of different quality, but will run better and longer on the fuel they were designed for. Eat the foods your body was designed for. Avoid grains, beans, sugar and dairy. 3) Get rid of waist materials. They are toxic. This includes the obvious, but also useless worry, emotions and old ways of doing things, that no longer work. 4) Machines are meant to be run. They degenerate if they just sit there and do nothing. Get exercise. Rick Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12957 From: Lorraine Brutsman Subject: Good getting better Hi Keysters, I know I'm a day behind with this post and JJ has probably already finished this but I wanted to throw my 2cents in. I have believed from my college days for studying sociology that the good was getting better and the bad was getting worse. But I believe now that for the most part a greater Christ Consciousness is covering the globe. I can tell you of a time in history that so many people were getting into the oneness principle. Look at how many of us came from all over the world because we all heard the call of JJ's book. We are beginning to think alike and move toward the same goal. When in history were so many different people committed to world peace? We has our attention been on so many different populations? Even 50 years ago there was prejudice and bigotry. We are definitely getting better. But at the same time, we didn't have gangs out in the open and obvious attempts at the demoralization of the human being that we accept today. So, the better are getting better and the bad are getting worse. Sorry if this comes after JJ has already addressed it. Lorraine Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12958 From: "Craig Tholson" < Subject: Re: Things Getting Better From: "J J Dewey": "What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health?" The physical form we call "body" is animated and kept alive by the higher form we call spirit or soul. Whatever we call the "essence" that is us matters not. What matters is that we recognize and work with this essence, for it is the giver and taker of our physical well-being. We will become exactly what we believe we will become. Of course there is a road which leads to this recognition which may involve one or more of the following: 1)Stop toxifing ourselves which involves but is not limited to DCATS. Drugs, Caffeine, Alcohol, Tobacco, Sugar. (I've done them all to excess) 2)Ingest healthy foods, may involve vegetarian diets, fruits & veggies, etc. 3)Antibiotics kill the immune system while they perform the desired effect, thus leaving one more susceptible to pathogens. 4)Live in healthy environments, not cities. Live near nature where our bodies naturally are inclined to do better. My mom wrote me something about going blind if I didn't stop doing something, but I can't see well enough to read it . Does anyone know what it might be? Love, Craig Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12959 From: Brian Weis Subject: Re: Craig's eyesight Sitting too close to the television set? ~B. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12960 From: Claire Subject: Re: Things Getting Better J J Dewey wrote: 'What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health?" 1) Think positive thoughts. 2) Don't think. 3) Don't think. 4) Don't think. Claire o:) Man is God in man becoming God. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12961 From: "* Zia" Subject: [OT] Another Correspondence Loving greetings, One of the wonderful 'side-effects' of being on the list, considering the 'lessons' and receiving such a great variety of perspectives, causes this 'food for thought' to gently simmer, sometimes seemingly cooking for days until 'ready to be served'!! We have discussed ONENESS at different times, and how to achieve that, and the benefits of ONENESS, yet so many seem to 'think' this is unattainable, while in a physical body. Using the Law of Correspondences suddenly a number of pieces of the puzzle slipped into place. JJ brought up about the brain being only capable of thinking one thought at a time. The brain although complex has but one processor it would seem that all thoughts must go through. We have also been gyrating through the universe from sub atomic levels through to the totality of the universe and wondering if there are more universes. Somehow my brain has been stretching and contracting in considerable proportions. Great exercise. Suddenly I understand why I have not been able to be in two places physically at once. Or more than two places. And why God knows everything, all thoughts past present and future and why I do not!! Because I can only think one thought at a time... I think thoughts separately. I 'think' I can only be in one place at a time, I see here and there as separated. I also think that all the rules change when I am not in my body... wonder if that is because I am not using my single processor brain!! Yet the real surprise of this is... that if I included the two places I wanted to be together as 'one', then I could think that 'one' thought, and thus be in two places at once. I have no separation of two thoughts anymore and therefore am in both places at once!! I am not trying to go somewhere or leave somewhere... I am both places at once, for they are ONE in my thought. This is to me the secret of ONENESS. Inclusion into ONE thought. So how does God know every thought....because there is no separation into consecutive thoughts... there is only ONE BIG GIGANTIC ENORMOUS THOUGHT encompassing all parts simultaneously... the NOW and what a processor that would seem to take.... but wait a minute (oops).. WE are the processor all together processing all the thoughts of God all at once, including great picturing detail... and to God it is ONE thought. So in separation coming and going seems to be real and take time... in oneness there is no coming and going... for everywhere is here and all of time is now. Where could I not be?? Loving servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-09/12962 From: (Jean) Subject: In answer to J.Js question, 3/9/00 I believe that the answer would be in awareness.... People today, in the evil that exists, are as they always have been. The awareness of it is what has increased. And in my opinion as this awareness increases, so does righteousness. I believe in the same breath, people are coming together more now than ever before, do to this awareness. My included homepage: http://community.webtv.net/Timber-roo/TheSandsOfTime Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12963 From: xavier Subject: Re: Things Getting Better Diet Exercise (and breathing) Sleep Sexuality Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12964 From: xavier Subject: Re: Response to Keith J J Dewey writes: "Question: Many people new age and old age believe that the people on this planet at this present time are the most evil bunch in history." Do they? I didn't know that. "Do you believe this to be true?" Bleep, no! (oops!) "Is the righteousness of the people on this planet increasing or decreasing?" Increasing. Now we live in an age of darkness, but this relates to our societies, not to the average level of humankind which is steadily rising. Darkness here relates to the exteriorization of the Hierarchy. In times past and other civilizations, the Hierarchy was ruling politically. They say that a few millennia ago, the mind, the separative mind, was a conquest of the initiates, the average man had none, only emotions as his higher developed body. Nowadays, most people have minds, don't they? We're trying to develop the higher mind now (hey this IS slow isn't it? lol) Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12965 From: J J Dewey Subject: Food 4 Thought Let us finish our thoughts on correspondences and then move on to health. (1) Many are predicting drastic earth changes. Over the past 40 years tremendous earth changes have been predicted and many various dates have been set. They all have one thing in common is that so far the predictions have all been wrong. Does this mean that we can relax and stop building our arks? Not necessarily. Earth changes is one item that is an historically recognized fact. They do occur from time to time. The good news is that drastic earth changes are many years apart, but the bad news is that we are making a major planetary shift into new age energies. Overall the shift of energies from one astrological age to another creates a point of tension on the earth and some changes usually occur. When approximately twelve ages have passed more significant changes occur. Then there are greater cycles still. Each astrological age is 2166 years making the larger cycle 25,922 years. Earth changes do not always appear on the cusp of cycles but the change of energy makes physical changes more likely. For instance, there were a lot of earth changes in the time of Moses as the ages shifted from Taurus to Aries This is not only indicated in the Bible but many catastrophic events were recorded around this time by the ancient Chinese and other eastern nations as well as ancient Indian people in the Western Hemisphere In my book on the gathering I have talked about another cause of each changes and this is the vacuum within energy caused by the gathering of lights. In the days of Moses the Egyptians would have suffered no harm if they would have merely freed the slaves and Pharaoh's army would not have been covered by the waters of the Red Sea if they had not attempted to destroy the Israelites. Even so in this age the amount of destruction to come is largely dependent on the resistance of the world to the gathering of lights which is to come. There will not be any major destruction until first the gathering has began. (2) Many are predicting a visit from space aliens who will rapture us similar to the Christian belief about the coming of Christ. We are not visited nearly as frequently as the UFO people would lead us to believe and there is no evidence or even information given out by the Masters that such an event will occur in any foreseeable future. (3) Many are predicting a shift into a 5th, 6th or some other dimension which will transform all human life. There is even less evidence that any dimensional shift is to suddenly occur. I've come across numerous prophecies about specific dates of dimensional shifts and so far they gave all been wrong. Many are so brazen to even leave the wrong prophesies on their web sire for all to see - such as the earth will be transformed into the 8th dimension on April 12, 1998 type of thing. True believers do not seemed moved by these false predictions. Now let us move to the current question: What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health? Xavier is entirely right when he asks: "But JJ, all these physical functions are heavily influenced by our emotions and thoughts." JJ True and we shall get to this, but let us cover this subject methodically and start with the physical. By the way, if a cheerful attitude brings good health Zia should be pretty robust for her post was very positive. So items of importance for health from the aspect of the physical that have been named are: Diet, exercise, breathing, sleep (I need more of this one), a good marriage, beautiful surroundings, avoiding toxins, healthy sex life, proper elimination, and living in a healthy environment. There is one important one that has not been named and that is sunshine. The sun has been much maligned lately, but the right amount of sun does have a very beneficial effect. Again we realize there are many factors beyond the physical plane that effect good health such as positive thinking mentioned by Claire and we shall get into these type of thoughts later, but for now let us talk about one of the most important things we can do with physical plane activity and that is diet. Many health enthusiasts see diet alone as almost a cure all for all diseases. While it is not true that diet is all we need we must surely acknowledge that the food we eat does play an important roll. Included in diet we shall place water which is also extremely important. Question: What are the three most important things to consider when deciding on a food to eat? Copyright 2000 By J.J. Dewey All Rights Reserved Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-11/12966 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Food 4 Thought J J Dewey wrote: "Question: What are the three most important things to consider when deciding on a food to eat?" I don't know what the three most important things are but here are three *relatively* important considerations: - genetic makeup - vibratory rate (of consumer and food - which also impacts on the latter's nutritive value) - pre-existing health conditions and one for luck - moderation - except in the case of chocolate which is exempt from all rules of a limiting nature (or so Zor told me). Love Glenys -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- There is nothing in a caterpillar that tells you it's going to be a butterfly. - Buckminster Fuller Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12967 From: Marylin Subject: Re: Food 4 Thought JJ writes: "What are the three most important things to consider when deciding on a food to eat?" The first thought that comes to mind is "nutrition" but that is "the cap on the bottle" type of word. We purchase groceries thinking we are choosing healthful items but too often do not give thought to the way they were 'grown to packaging' for sale. Also in the processing plants, we seldom think much about what is added to the food that is being canned, bottled, etc. Some products used for growing and "canning" are more dangerous that alcohol or nicotine. (not to be minimizing their danger) The three most important things I think about when deciding on something to eat: 'Are the protein and carbohydrate components balanced adequately?' I think of this because of having lived with either a type 2 or a type 1 diabetic for the last 26 years. 'Was this grown locally or distantly?' According to Cayce, food grown your local area is much better for you. I think it has to do with the certain minerals in the ground that your body adapts to. Anyone ever get sick when on vacation at a good distance from home? 'Wonder how many pesticides were used on this?' Ever since DDT back in the 40's and 50's, more and more illnesses such as hyperactivity have increased. Maybe the increase was meant to be, but then again, maybe it wasn't necessary that it happened. I better stop here from writing a book. Love, Light, Peace and Harmony Marylin Other things I think about: It's possible that the pesticides and weed killer products may have been pulled into the growing food through the roots and now it's about to be eaten by me. Glad I take a large mg of Vitamin E and C. In the canning factories, they add far too much salt. I could swear they canned those beans with water from Salt Lake. Guess the frozen one's are better. But still don't know what was sprayed on them to keep the bean beetles away. Too bad farmers don't go along with organic gardening en masse. Petunias planted with beans do a wonderful job of preventing the bean beetles from coming in and munching the new little beans. Geraniums planted with cabbage products deter the white butterflies that like to lay eggs and little green larvae from the eggs love cabbage, broccoli, cauliflower. Then they have to be soaked in salt water to get the little buggers out before any processing can be done. And what if one is left behind? Hmmmmm?I suppose they could be coated with chocolate. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12968 From: Claire Subject: Re: Food 4 Thought "Question: What are the three most important things to consider when deciding on a food to eat? " 1) Listen to the body to hear what it needs. That's the only one I can think of, that hasn't already been covered, or will be covered. We don't know the process food goes thru before we get it, canned, frozen or fresh, so I just ask God to remove all harmful additives before I eat. Claire o:) Man is God in man becoming God. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12969 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: 12th Planet returning? JJ: For instance, there were a lot of earth changes in the time of Moses as the ages shifted from Taurus to Aries This is not only indicated in the Bible but many catastrophic events were recorded around this time by the ancient Chinese and other eastern nations as well as ancient Indian people in the Western Hemisphere Judes: JJ..could you comment on your opinion for the 12th planet theory..that Sitchin and Velikovsky advocate as the resaon for some of the catastrophic earth changes? There is a web-site called Zeta-Talk..where a group of Zeta-Reticulans are telepathically communicating to an their emissary on earth that this planet will approach our planet on its 3600 year orbit and cause a major pole-shift, Is there any truth to this? Sitchin does not say if or when this planet may be returning through our solar system..but he does have historical information from Sumerian texts that say the 12th planet's return seems to preclude major disasters. I know you want us to use our own intuition...and oddly..I 'get' yes it is true and no it isn't. LOL IOW..I guess I cannot read this one yet. I was wondering if you had heard of these predictions or theories? And I would value much your opinion. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12970 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: Re: Food 4 Thought JJ: What are the three most important things to consider when deciding on a food to eat? Judes: 1.) Toxin-free..organic if possible 2.) Wholeness..not over-processed 3.) Real...IOW not artificial like oleo ...manufactured sugars, etc. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12971 From: John Kosior Subject: Re: Food 4 Thought JJ: "What are the three most important things to consider when deciding on a food to eat?" From the Bachelor's Guide to Eating: 1) Will it kill us? 2) Does it LOOK like it will kill us? 3) After eating it, do we WISH it would kill us? Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12972 From: "Stardancer" Subject: Things Getting Better JJ: What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health? Ray: Exercise or 'Body Motion and Rest' It is important to realize some of the changes that have taken place within our society over the past 100 -200 years. We have moved into the information age and most people spend their days sitting at a computer terminal or some other job that eliminates movement from their daily routine. A routine that included 8-12 hours of physical motion which our ancestors lived on a daily basis. We now take that amount of motion and pack it into 45 minutes of cardio and think that we have managed to compensate. The idea here is to increase our bodies ability for oxygen uptake. Oxygen is the natural cellular cleanser as well as the element for proper calorie utilization, among other things. Anything that we can do to increase body motion, such as walking instead of driving, cutting wood for the fireplace, bike riding with our kids, gardening, etc.. (Notice that these are all outdoor activities). Not only do these things increase our physical well being but also balance the aspects of our spiritual and emotional needs as well. I would also throw a healthy and active sexual life in this category as well. Proper rest is as much a part of exercise as moving is. I worked with a well known Olympic Trainer in CA a few years ago and the one thing he taught me in designing his programs for his athletes was the importance of "Time Off". He had his athletes on a 6 week on 2 week off program. If you are familiar with athlete psychy you will know that this is almost impossible for them to comply with, but he insisted. It proved the key factor in improving their performance. The body loves cycles and we need to do more in applying them for health. Rest doesn't mean doing nothing - It means a change of routine. Meditation, Yoga, Tai Chi, Walking, Stretching, getting a good massage, Rebounding, playing games, etc.. Diet This can be a more complex question to answer. As a nutritionist, I have worked with hundreds of people over the years and the one thing I have discovered is Biochemical Individuality. Every program that I write up for clients is different depending on the individual and his/her needs. It is impossible for me now to recommend the 4 basic food groups to anyone. There are things that need to be taken into consideration when looking at food and nutrition and maybe this will cover JJ's second question and add to what has already been discussed. When designing a nutrition program for a client I look at a number of things. 1: The first of which is blood type and ancestry. These two indicators provide the information for the food lists and whether or not vegetarianism is indicated. Certain blood types obtain much needed amino acids from the more dense forms of animal protein. 2:The second thing is glandular dominance. This provides needed information for proper ratio of protein, carbohydrates and fats. 3:The third thing is metabolic burn. Some people are fast burners and others are slow. 4:The fourth thing is somatotype or physical structure and where the bodies fat pads are located. There are other indicators as well, one of which is essential to take into consideration for women is hormone balance. The 3 systems that need balancing are the sugar, stress and sex hormones. These can be balanced by choosing the right foods and the right supplements. Pure Water is an essential nutrient and should be consumed in large amounts on a daily basis. It is changed when consumed as pop, tea, coffee, juice or any other form, and the body doesn't recognize it as H2O. Putting the most natural substances in the body is a good way of increasing longevity and boosting natural immunity. Growing your own or eating locally grown food is a good place to start. Eating properly includes abstaining from harmful substances, but I must add here, how do you know what is harmful or not? One mans food is another man's poison! I would address the intangible aspects of improving ones health but I don't want to write a book and Zia did a marvelous job in her post. In closing I would also add, it has become a matter of record in our home that the most important ingredient in anything that is prepared is love. You can ask anyone that has eaten anything that has been prepared by Trish's hands. The food has a different taste and feeling to it. It is incredible!! AND prayer does have the ability to increase the resonance and transmute any negative energy that may harm. With Much Love and Healing Ray Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12973 From: (Rick Audette) Subject: Re: Food 4 Thought "What are the three most important things to consider when deciding on a food to eat?" DO NOT EAT THE FRUIT OF THE TECHNOLOGY THAT MAKES EDIBLE THE INEDIBLE. [Gen. 2:17] (yes, it really does say that. See Strong's) When you go to the grocery store, the good food is found along the back and side walls, closest to the receiving docks (meat, fruit and veggies), because it must be fresh. The food they keep in the isles is manufactured and full of preservatives (poisons) and is as nutritious as styrofoam. Research, going back 100 years, clearly shows that as much as 95% of the current world death rate can be traced to eating foods which humans are not genetically suited to. [see bibliography link at http://www.neanderthin.com ] End world hunger, eat bugs, Rick Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12974 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: Response to Keith "Question: Many people new age and old age believe that the people on this planet at this present time are the most evil bunch in history. Do you believe this to be true? Is the righteousness of the people on this planet increasing or decreasing?" I'm not sure how much of this is metaphor and how much is "real," but assuming "the righteousness of the people" is light, then wherever that light fails to penetrate is darkness or shadow. It follows that if there is more light on the planet, then more distinct shadows are cast. It is obvious to some extent that some are remaining in their old shadows, where they are comfortable with their old ways of control and fear and guilt. It is also obvious that we are experiencing an explosion of new and free ideas, leading many people to "approach Zion" in their own ways. Greater polarization aside, I think it's a damn cool day to be incarnate, eh? Love, Craig Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12975 From: "Stardancer" Subject: Re: Response to Keith Craig, A question! Are we increasing the polarization or are we moving into a new phase of existence that transcends the yin-yang of life? And, yes, I agree with you! There isn't another place in this universe I would rather be right now - even though I am! With much love and healing Ray Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12976 From: J J Dewey Subject: The First Consideration Judes post hints at the first consideration for intelligently choosing a food to eat. 1.) Toxin-free..organic if possible 2.) Wholeness..not over-processed 3.) Real...IOW not artificial like oleo ...manufactured sugars, etc. These three are incorporated into the first consideration. As far as the Twelfth Planet goes I started reading that book at one time and could not get into it. There may be some truth there, but I didn't feel drawn by great light. For those of you who have read it can you tell me if this planet is supposed to be currently populated? If so how do they survive when the temperature on the surface would be 400 degrees below zero? I was drawn to the writings of Velikovsky and believe that he has discovered many hints of real truth. By the way, Velikovsky did not see the visiting planet as coming from beyond the orbit of Pluto, but he says we have been visited by both Mars and Venus and Venus passed by our earth as it left an orbit as a moon around Jupiter. He increased his credibility by successfully predicting the makeup of the atmosphere of Venus before our spacecraft arrived there to take readings. Copyright 2000 By J.J. Dewey All Rights Reserved Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12977 From: Rob Subject: Re: Food 4 Thought J J Dewey wrote: "Question: What are the three most important things to consider when deciding on a food to eat?" When I decide on what i should eat I consider my energy needs at the time. Do I need a quick burst of energy? Then I'll choose something like an apple or whatever else with high carbs or sugars which will give me that quick burst of short-lived energy. If I need a level of energy that's pretty much constant over a longer period of time than I'll eat high-protein, low-carb, low-sugar foods--meats, eggs, etc. Another consideration is which foods will give me the proper nutrients, vitamins, and minerals. The shade and clarity of urine gives good measures on the level of hydration and level of calcium in the body. If it's too dark or cloudy I know I should drink more water and take more calcium. That's all i can think of right now. Hope I haven't grossed people out. Rob Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12978 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: Food 4 Thought From: "J J Dewey" There is one important one that has not been named and that is sunshine. The sun has been much maligned lately, but the right amount of sun does have a very beneficial effect. Craig says: I remember growing up watching all of my adult peers getting into the fashion crazy sun-glass wearing mode. It never really caught on with me, and when I was studying physics, I came across a study that demonstrated a correlation between aging and good eye sight that was strengthened in those who never wore sun glasses. My generation was taught that you should never look at the sun, that it would destroy the retina of your eye. I work outside much of the year and get a lot of exposure to the sun. I have a meditation I like to do which involves looking directly at sun rises and sun sets. I am 43 and the last eye test I had claimed I had 20/18 vision. JJ's Question: What are the three most important things to consider when deciding on a food to eat? Craig: 1) If the food has eyes, turn them away from you as you cut into it. 2)Fruit makes you happier in the short term if it is aged and fermented. 3)Beans and cabbage give you gas. Love, Craig Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12979 From: Brian Weis Subject: Re: Food 4 Thought Craig Tholson writes: "(3) Beans and cabbage give you gas" Yeah, and Beanie Babies and Cabbage Patch Kids aren't much better. ~B. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12980 From: "Stardancer" Subject: Re: Food 4 Thought Craig: Trish and I just love the way your mind works, Craig. We are looking forward to meeting you sometime. Maybe you could meet us at Orvis Hot Springs, CO next month when we go over for our annual clothing optional vacation. With Much Love and Healing Ray and Trish Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12981 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: re: First Consideration and more To JJ: Great that I zinged the first consideration..like I said..I know it is probably simple..but waiting to here more and enjoying and gleaning from others expanded thoughts on this. And Craig..you are such a delight..both you and Brian. I told my boyfriend about some of the witty replies on the list from some of the men..hoping he will get the desire to go with me to Idaho[hate to travel alone since Jane passed] and he totally related to your answers. And Ray...glad you are joining us today...your presence is adding much. JJ..I ring more with Velikovsky..but, some of the 12th planet's return advocates use Velikovsky as proof of pole-shifting and radical earth changes due to a closely passing comet or planet. But..I do know he proposed that the upheavals were due to other planet shifting in orbit, etc. FYI..I have heard that the 12th planet [actually 10th..because the moon and sun are included] from possible theories on the warmth..is due to a possible radioactive atmosphere that contains fine particles of gold dust. Sitchin theorized that they sent migratory teams to Earth to mine for Gold whenever the passed near us. I could not read Sitchin's books either..and tried about three times and then gave up. I use to read the Cliff notes in H.S. instead of reading the classics Moby Dick, Charles Dickens, etc.] to write book reports [okay..I tried to cheat]. So..I thought this showed that I was not tenacious enough on reading certain books/authors. But..you make this sound as a possible 'hint' that there may not be pertinent information for the soul within the book..so the contents may not be necessary. Makes sense to me anyway..so I will just leave that alone..which I seem to have anyway..due to non-interest. Just the opposite with Velikovsky , though..could not put his books down. Judes Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12982 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: The First Consideration From: "J J Dewey" As far as the Twelfth Planet goes I started reading that book at one time and could not get into it. There may be some truth there, but I didn't feel drawn by great light. For those of you who have read it can you tell me if this planet is supposed to be currently populated? If so how do they survive when the temperature on the surface would be 400 degrees below zero? Craig: Surviving on a planet which does not receive most of its energy from a star is quite reasonable to me, although my astrophysics professors would have disagreed with me. They taught me that Saturn produces more energy than they can explain through gravitational contraction, natural means, etc,. Saturn receives about one percent of the solar radiation we do on earth, and should be an icy ball, but measurements indicate otherwise. Saturn has an unknown source of energy - maybe cold fusion? The same is true for all the gaseous giants in our solar system. Simply put, these planets radiate more energy than they receive from the sun and can be explained by known physics. Anyone who wants to learn more about Sitchin's book series called the "Earth Chronicles," can go to: http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/Island/2771/page02.html Sitchin is rather brilliant in most all of his conclusions and they overlay very well on our myths and religious "histories," giving intelligent reasons for the way we have been told history ran. JJ: I was drawn to the writings of Velikovsky and believe that he has discovered many hints of real truth. By the way, Velikovsky did not see the visiting planet as coming from beyond the orbit of Pluto, but he says we have been visited by both Mars and Venus and Venus passed by our earth as it left an orbit as a moon around Jupiter. He increased his credibility by successfully predicting the makeup of the atmosphere of Venus before our spacecraft arrived there to take readings. Craig: Anthony E. Larson did the best laymen's treatment of Velikovsky I have ever read. It's called the Prophecy Trilogy. 3 small books written by a Mormon author which are very good. Earth In Upheaval & Worlds In Collision are cumbersome at best. Larson makes Velikovsky fun and interesting, and ties in many religious, historical and Mormon themes. His web site is: http://www.mormonprophecy.com PeaceLoveDove, Craig Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12983 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: Re: First Considerataion again JJ: Could the first consideration be as simple as...ingest only those things that have the highest good for the body and the most easily digestible? Judes Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12984 From: J J Dewey Subject: Close Judes asks: Could the first consideration be as simple as...injest only those things that have the highest good for the body and the most easily digestible? JJ Close. What kinds of food are generally recognized (by health enthusiasts) as being the most beneficial for our bodies? Copyright 2000 By J.J. Dewey All Rights Reserved Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12985 From: "Craig Tholson" Subject: Re: Close In "Highlander 2" Sean Connery said, "I never eat anything which I can not identify." He then leaned over to the attractive woman sitting next to him and whispered, "Excepting of course................(inaudible)" I must be close on this one, JJ. Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-11/12986 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: Things Getting Better Loving greetings, Rather late today in response, just about everything has been said it seems... yet the responses were so much fun, gosh we are even developing a great healthy sense of humor here!! Just love it! Have responded within Ray's comments, since they have resonated so well within me. JJ: What are four (or more) things we can do on the physical plane to improve health? Ray: We now take that amount of motion and pack it into 45 minutes of cardio and think that we have managed to compensate. The idea here is to increase our bodies ability for oxygen uptake. Oxygen is the natural cellular cleanser as well as the element for proper calorie utilization, among other things. Anything that we can do to increase body motion, such as walking instead of driving, cutting wood for the fireplace, bike riding with our kids, gardening, etc.. (Notice that these are all outdoor activities). Well said Ray... I have had to get on the physio/cardio machines simply because my yoga, chopping wood, stacking, gardening (7 months of year), walking the dog, just did not balance enough with time spent in focus, and computering, and homemaking for a couple of reasons not mentioned in your post. A critical factor not considered yet that I have seen, is that 95% of the world has an acidic digestion system... this is tested through the urine. What was startling was myself, husband, and son, are in the rare group of being alkaline. This one factor greatly influences digestion, and increased weight etc. So what usually works for most people as a general rule did not work for me at all!! In fact the whole purpose was to gain an alkaline balance in the body, because then diseases such as cancers etc could not even begin! However, alkaline plus slower metabolism gained through years of meditation/focus etc... meant the digestive process slowed as well, requiring the aid of acids in the foods!! And amino acids etc... being gained from the foods. You have mentioned something similar under metabolic burn... this really has an effect. How and when this is tested is also important it seems. Many people drink alkaline water... we need to drink acidic water... and enjoy vinegar dressings and glorious wine etc!! The other point that Trish pointed out I believe, is about hormone balance... a very critical factor today... and many women are going through dramatic hormone changes and imbalances much earlier in life now.. which may be due to stress and diet... so for me a balance of foods, understanding one's body chemistry and activities, and striving for 'harmony' to assist the hormonal balance in the body is vital in my opinion. After I wrote my post earlier I was astonished that I left out water, since I have worked with so many types of water.... yet instantly realize we often think of this with diet... yet our water and what is in it, is quite a critical factor, and I realized this also from AAB and what is carried in the substance of our earth from times past, is in our earth and particularly its water... that we take in so readily. Ray: You can ask anyone that has eaten anything that has been prepared by Trish's hands. The food has a different taste and feeling to it. It is incredible!! AND prayer does have the ability to increase the resonance and transmute any negative energy that may harm. Zia: I was so happy to see the above mentioned. While cooking I am very conscious of my mental state of mind, my full presence in the now, and conscious of my hands and the food and the energy flow. Prayer is vital over food before consumption, and sometimes the prayer comes out as a song being sung (not our Song of 144,000) but actually singing, sometimes a poem is given, and the energising effect on food is stunning. Consciously bringing the energy of the food to its highest level... and laying the thought of radiant health and vitality onto the food, and thus consuming that thought to manifest it is to me a magnificent heightening of the food value... and is quite noticeable. OUr thoughts do indeed affect our reality. I would recommend people singing the song of 144,000 over their food... and seeing the light love and power in their food, it does work miracles... the thought is the factor to me. I also agree with supplements because of the conditions of our food and water... and although we eat out of the garden a lot six months of the year.... I find maintaining energy so uplifting that I 'love to assist' mother nature when she seems distant from my food!! Loving servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-11/12987 From: "* Zia" Subject: Re: Food 4 Thought Loving greetings, As always have enjoyed your posts Craig, and in particular this one!! Filled with wisdom and laughter, great combo!! From: "J J Dewey" There is one important one that has not been named and that is sunshine. The sun has been much maligned lately, but the right amount of sun does have a very beneficial effect. Craig says: I remember growing up watching all of my adult peers getting into the fashion crazy sun-glass wearing mode. It never really caught on with me, and when I was studying physics, I came across a study that demonstrated a correlation between aging and good eye sight that was strengthened in those who never wore sun glasses. My generation was taught that you should never look at the sun, that it would destroy the retina of your eye. I work outside much of the year and get a lot of exposure to the sun. I have a meditation I like to do which involves looking directly at sun rises and sun sets. I am 43 and the last eye test I had claimed I had 20/18 vision. Zia: Yes I learnt a similar function from my Kahuna friends in Hawaii. They understood how much time I spent in 'darkness' of focus and meditation etc... and recommended on a rising sun, to cast the eyes just below the sun from left to right, and beside it top to earth... not actually looking into the sun... so I do this as well... since we also live in quite a cloudy environment... we always celebrate the sun I assure you here!! I have actually in my life improved my eyesight from half blind to perfect vision, not having to wear glasses to fly or drive... that was done through various disciplines and focus, and has brought me great delight. And yes I see the sun as quite valuable. Another I would add JJ is swimming in the ocean, if one can find fairly clean ocean... the sun, and salt water combination is very rejuvenating and cleansing to the body. Great in Australia... not so great here. JJ's Question: What are the three most important things to consider when deciding on a food to eat? Craig: 1) If the food has eyes, turn them away from you as you cut into it. 2)Fruit makes you happier in the short term if it is aged and fermented. 3)Beans and cabbage give you gas. Zia: From a practical point of view, 1. preparation time and how starving everyone is!! 2. HOw to include balance of nutritional requirements and create a masterpiece of delight in double-quick time (I am spoilt with my french cooking husband... I used to eat salad and rice as one meal a day when he met me... he was horrified to say the least... now I am spoilt with such delicacies and of course that also is cause for the gym!!) 3. It's freshness or vitality... one thing I learnt was to walk in my garden and munch as the sun is rising... the energy and juices are also rising in fresh vegetables etc and are so delightful straight out of the garden... one eats so little in comparison to any other food... when it is fresh and vital! Loving servant of God, ZIA Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-11/12988 From: Glenys Lowery Subject: Re: Close J J Dewey wrote: "Close. What kinds of food are generally recognized (by health enthusiasts) as being the most beneficial for our bodies?" Those at the bottom of the food chain/pyramid as they are generally less processed and contain fewer toxins. Love Glenys -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- There is nothing in a caterpillar that tells you it's going to be a butterfly. - Buckminster Fuller Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-10/12989 From: "Judy Reese" Subject: Close raw ..whole foods...like veggies and fruits..nuts...grains[sorry, Rick..but they have protein], legumes. Seems to me that vegetarian would be better..as meat is hard to digest..but eggs and dairy products are good..because of protein and calcium. Butter or ghee..and olive oils. Breads..and fish or shell-foods seem good to me. Lots of fresh-juiced fruit and vegetable juices..herbal teas..and 8-12 glasses of spring or well water/day. Can't help but think that food- combining might be good to assist digestion. It is not hard ..I have done it and it seems to work. Also the Natural Hygiene diet that recommends fruits in a.m...then veggies rest of day with maybe fish or poultry with eve. meal with several snacks of raw vegetables, juices, and nuts. This worked for me before when ever I want to rejuvenate myself and cured my hypoglycemia and stress. Love: Judes Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-11/12990 From: xavier Subject: Re: Close J J Dewey writes: "Close. What kinds of food are generally recognized (by health enthusiasts) as being the most beneficial for our bodies?" Living food;-) life bearing food. Like germinated grains. Growing food, that could go on growing by itself (thus bearing life). Post No. keys-l: /2000-03-11/12991 From: J J Dewey Subject: The Second Consideration In advancing with the subject of health here I might state that this is one subject that almost every seeker in every clime has some interest in and has done considerable study and thinking on. Consequently, I expect some interesting comments form the group. I particularly want to compliment Ray on his comments here - very thoughtful and insightful. Welcome to the group. The question: What are the three most important things to consider when deciding on a food to eat? Several are getting close to the first consideration here so I will elaborate on the principle. They key word behind this principle is LIFE as in the life force or vitality, that is present in the food. There are four categories of food having this vital energy and I will list them in order of importance. (1) Foods that are yet alive such as sprouts or freshly picked or well preserved fruits and vegetables. These are not only have powerful vital energy but also have enzymes that are lacking in other foods. (2) Foods having dormant life such as grains, beans, nuts and seeds (3) Foods having a preserved lif