2005-1-8 04:58:00
In reference to my statement that God is limited in power in time and space Tom writes:
"Jesus calmed a storm in the bible. He had power, yet GOD does not have any more power then we do? Why did (GODS) own refection (Jesus) have this power to stop storms?"
JJ:
Good to hear from you again. I was just thinking about you this morning.
I did not say that God does not have power, but in the worlds of time and space he has limitations. He manifests through his reflections which have the seeds of unlimited power within them. When that power within is discovered and nurtured then the power of God is increased in manifestation.
Jesus recognized his oneness with God and was thus able to bring some of the powers of God down to the earth. But even Jesus was limited. The Bible says he could do no miracles in his own town because they did not believe on him. He could not convince the Pharisees that he was a messenger from God. He could not even convince his apostles who he was until after the resurrection.
My point was that God's power is manifested through his reflections -- us. Every miracle in the Bible takes place through some human being dispensing it.
Let us look at what some consider to be modern miracles.
A man is stranded in a wilderness after a plane crash. Several weeks pass and search parties give up. The man's father feels within that his son is still alive and does not give up. He goes on one more search alone and after much struggle he finally finds his son and saves his life. The son thanks God.
But, if the father did not use all the powers of God within him the son would have remained lost.
Even so each of us must use the power of God within us to serve our fellow men. When we do this and afterwards hear one who is helped exclaim "thank God!" We then can rest assured that we are acting as agents of God's power and more power will be forthcoming.
We never have the case of God coming down from the heavens and finding the lost man and floating him over to safety. Instead God finds and saves the man through his reflections, you and me.
The very fact that time and space exists tells us that any life, including God, that manifests in them will be limited. This is illustrated in the conundrum of the question: "can God make a rock so heavy he cannot lift it?"
God made the earth, but because of the limitations of time, creation so far here has taken over four billion years.
All power is available to the reflections of God, but that power must be filtered through the limitations of time and space in this physical plane.
Tom:
"Did GOD'S power grow in Jesus as he gained the power to do so and then he over came his limitations?"
Yes, and as we put God's power within us to "right-use" it will grow within us.
The truth of the matter is this. God manifests through the life forms in which he has reflected himself, and only has as much power as you and I are able to manifest.
Tom:
"X-mas has passed and Dec 25 Is Jesus Birthday. But what was his real B-day? We all know the church or something choose that date?"
JJ:
Christmas occurs near the winter solstice or the first day of winter. Legend has it that the saviors of the race are born during this period of deepest night and darkness to lead us into the greatest light.
Since the church authorities did not know the true birth of Christ they thought that December 25th was as good as any, especially since it was already a Roman holiday centuries before the birth of Christ. On this day the Romans celebrated the mirthraic feast of the Sun-god. Also from December 17-23 they held a great festival honoring Saturn, the god of agriculture.
Early Christians were reluctant to celebrate the birth of Christ until the Church at Rome declared it as a day of celebration around 320 A.D.
Few scholars, however seriously believe that Jesus was born in December. For one thing, shepherds were not in the fields during the winter.
The Mormon prophet Joseph Smith stated that Jesus was born April 6th, and some think this was also his resurrection day. Most scholars agree that spring was a probable time of his birth.
Below is a excerpt from a previous post of mine about possible times for the appearance of the Star of Bethlehem, which probably occurred a short time after his birth.
So what was this new star which appeared?
Actually between 7 BC-1B C there were numerous "signs" in the heavens that a person of destiny was about to arrive. For one thing the age of Pisces was solidly over the threshold, yet no new Moses or Savior of the new age of Pisces had yet arrived. In the minds of astrologers of the day the time of his coming could not be delayed much longer.
Here are some signs:
Thus we see that astrologers watching for signs during this time period had plenty of anomalies to behold that seemed to portend a great event on the horizon. Surely the people of that time were living in a period of great expectation. Does the scripture give us any additional clues about the event? Let us take a closer look:
"Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men (Magi/Sstrologers) from the east to Jerusalem, Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him." (Matt 2:1-2)
Here we learn that these particular Magi were definitely astrologers for they were followers of the stars.
A phrase of interest here is "we have seen his star in the east." "In the east," here comes from EN TE ANATOLE. When the singular "anatole" is used it's meaning means more than a literal "east" but in reference to a star takes on special astrological implications. The literal translation would be close to "star at the rising" or "Morning Star." It is interesting that "at the rising" is a definite astrological term and would indicate the last star visible on the ascendant. The last star or planet visible in the morning was also called the "Morning Star."
Notice that the magi call the star "his star." Why would they call the Morning star "his (Christ's) star?"
The answer is quite simple. Jesus said:
"I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star." (Rev 22:16)
It is also interesting that Luke identifies Jesus using the word ANATOLE:
"Through the tender mercy of our God; whereby the dayspring (ANATOLE -- rising or morning star) from on high (from HUPSOS -- heavenly place) hath visited us." (Luke 1:78)
The morning star is "his star" because he is the "morning star" for us. He is the light that guides us to the heart of the Sun. Apparently the magi knew this even before the birth of Christ.
Whereas Venus usually takes the title of "the morning star," Jupiter is also called this at times because it is sometimes a the brightest (and last) object visible in the morning sky.
Therefore when the magi spoke of "his star" they were either referring to Venus or Jupiter, or even possibly both of them in conjunction with each other or other planets. Venus and Jupiter conjuncted August 12, 3 BC June of 2 BC and August 21, 1 BC. Because of their brightness a conjunction would have produced a super star that may have even been visible after the sun came up.
Some scholars say this was not the star of Bethlehem because it is out of sink with the death of Herod who is said to have died in early 4 BC. However, there is some dispute on this because the source of this may have been based on misinformation supplied by his sons and a possible transcribing error by Josephus. Nevertheless, mainstream historians and coin experts stick with 4 BC as his death date.
If Herod did die in early 4 BC this means the great sign had to first appear 6 BC or earlier for the scripture tells us that "he had diligently enquired of the wise men" to discover "what time the star appeared." Afterwards in an attempt to kill the messiah he had all children under the age of two years killed. This would indicate that the sign appeared as far back as two years before the visit of the magi which would have been 6 BC or earlier.
The most spectacular sign in the heavens involving a "morning star in this time period was the triple planetary conjunction on Feb 6, 6 BC of Jupiter (a morning star), Saturn and Mars in Pisces. This only occurs once every 900 years.
Another lesser known celestial event is supported by a book called The Star of Bethlehem: The Legacy of the Magi by Michael R. Molnar. Molner contends that even though the age of Pisces was on the horizon the constellation of Aries of supreme importance for the Jews.
He writes:
"In the spring of 1990 I purchased a lovely bronze coin from ancient Antioch which portrayed the zodiacal sign, Aries the Ram looking back at an overhead star. I bought the coin for $50. But the coin turned out to be priceless because I found that this was the sign of the zodiac that represented King Herod's kingdom. The so-called 'bible of astrology' the Tetrabiblos of Claudius Ptolemy explained that Aries the Ram controlled the people of 'Judea, Idumea, Samaria, Palestine, and Coele Syria' -- lands ruled by King Herod. I think the coin was issued by the Romans of Antioch to commemorate their takeover of Judea in AD 6."
He further writes about a significant astrological event around the morning star of Jupiter:
"The second occultation (eclipse) on April 17 coincided precisely when Jupiter was "in the east," a condition mentioned twice in the biblical account about the Star of Bethlehem. In August of that year Jupiter became stationary and then "went before" through Aries where it became stationary again on December 19, 6 BC. This is when the regal planet "stood over." - a secondary royal portent also described in the Bible. In particular, there is confirmation from a Roman astrologer that the conditions of April 17, 6 BC were believed to herald the birth of a divine, immortal, and omnipotent person born under the sign of the Jews, which we now know was Aries the Ram. Furthermore, the coins of Antioch and ancient astrological documents show that there was indeed a Star of Bethlehem as reported in the biblical account of Matthew."
(Above quotes taken from the author's web page at: www.eclipse.net/~molnar/)
Molner mentions Jupiter standing over the young Jesus. He is referring to this scripture:
"When they had heard the king, they departed; and, lo, the star, which they saw in the east, went before them, till it came and stood over where the young child was." (Matt 2:9)
From this believers conjure up the idea that some magical light from the heavens shined some type of laser beam before the Magi until they arrived at Jesus' address.
This fanciful thinking dissipates when one sees the astrological meaning in the verse.
"Went before" comes from PROAGO which means to "lead forth" or "to go before."
"Stood over" comes from the Greek HISTEMI EPANO which is more accurately translated as "stopped above." Any amateur astrologer knows that when a planet stops in the above sky it is in transition period to go retrograde. It is seen to be standing still in the heavens, or "stationary direct."
Of course, the planets do not really stand still but because the orbits of each of the planets differ in length and distance an illusion is created from the vantage point of the earth and during the stationery direct period a visible planet will not appear to move in the sky.
This tells us that during the visit of the Magi to Bethlehem that either Venus or Jupiter went retrograde and stood still in the heavens for a time. The planet apparently went stationary direct at the same time they entered Bethlehem and the Magi took this as a sign from God that they had found the place of destiny.
"I am a part of all I have seen."
-- Alfred Lord Tennyson (1809 - 1892)
Copyright © 2005 by J.J. Dewey, All Rights Reserved